Dog Owner Chat v3 ~Open!~

[Keriae]

DOS never said they reward for biting behaviour. They attempt to reward for good behaviour and Epic bites as she's taking it, as far as I can see.

Cesar Milan has no standing in the scientific community and most owners now use positive reinforcement. There is a reason for it.

[Day Of Silence]

Apologies before hand for any snappiness or rudeness. I am genuinely trying to write this all in a calm manner but words can come out wrong.

Epic does not bite when she sees other dogs. She bites when she is stressed/anxious and it's not an actual 'red zone dog' bite as much as a 'quick, get the treats down' that hurts.
She does not get treats for biting, she gets treats for seeing a stimulus that is scary, be it people, kids, dogs or weird things. If she is over threshold we get out of the situation or gain distance, if she is having a decent response, then she is rewarded though more often then not, she will still go after the treats hard.
My dog is not disrespecting me, she's a scared nervous wreck who's either lacked socialization, got the wrong genetics or has had bad experiences.

I see no benefit in correcting fear. If my dog is scared of X, and every time she says that X scares her she gets Y, and Y is not pleasant, X is still going to be scary or become scarier because every time she sees X, Y happens.
I'm not against correcting dogs, there are times to do it, but I am against physical corrections for fear based behaviors.

We train every single day, multiple times a day, on every single walk.
We have been unable to find any trainer who will help with the methods that I can agree with, or have been unable to contact the one that I believe can help. So it's just me and will probably always be just me unless we get out of this area.

[Blu Malinois]

Hey guys just a quick question regarding the trick dog stuff, do you need to print out the application and send that as well as filling out the online form or no?
Also it's international right?

No, you just choose one option. You do not have to do both. And yes, it is international.

[Keriae]

Hey guys just a quick question regarding the trick dog stuff, do you need to print out the application and send that as well as filling out the online form or no?
Also it's international right?

No, you just choose one option. You do not have to do both. And yes, it is international.

Is it? I might look into it for Mary.

[Blu Malinois]

Hey guys just a quick question regarding the trick dog stuff, do you need to print out the application and send that as well as filling out the online form or no?
Also it's international right?

No, you just choose one option. You do not have to do both. And yes, it is international.

Is it? I might look into it for Mary.

I'm pretty sure. Because when I go to fill out my info, I always have to list which country I live in.

Edit: yep! I just double checked and it is international.

[Day Of Silence]

Just did a bit of bikejoring with Epic! She had a blast!
It was so awesome when she figured out that she was allowed to pull!
I had my sister on the bike, and then I had Epic on leash and I started off in front to encourage her, but by the end of the short time, I could go behind her and still have her pulling!

[SaraCO2013]

Do you own a dog?:
Yes 2 Pit Bulls. ^^

Favorite dog breed?:
To many to name lol, But off the top of my head: Akitas, Pits, Rottweiler, Dobes,
German Sheps, French Bulldogs, Italian Mastiffs and Great Danes.

Tell us about your dog(s), if you have any!:
I have posted on here a long long time ago with my dogs Molly, Blue and rescue Peanut. Since then Blue ran away (in someone elses care during our move), we have moved, Peanut now lives with my mother and we recently got a puppy. Molly has been lonely since Blue got loose, so it was time for a playmate and new addition. Thus brings Apollo, a 7 week old blue and white Am. Bully/Am. Pit bull mix. He is quite the rascal, currently working on his name and whats appropriate to bite and whats not appropriate. And of course my baby Molly Malls! She has tons of nicknames such as fat malls, evil malls, and the great white malls to name a few. She is my 2 1/2 year old white American Pit Bull, and weighs 50-55lbs and is completely spolied.

Pictures of your dog(s):

[Luzien]

@

Apologies before hand for any snappiness or rudeness. I am genuinely trying to write this all in a calm manner but words can come out wrong.

Epic does not bite when she sees other dogs. She bites when she is stressed/anxious and it's not an actual 'red zone dog' bite as much as a 'quick, get the treats down' that hurts.
She does not get treats for biting, she gets treats for seeing a stimulus that is scary, be it people, kids, dogs or weird things. If she is over threshold we get out of the situation or gain distance, if she is having a decent response, then she is rewarded though more often then not, she will still go after the treats hard.
My dog is not disrespecting me, she's a scared nervous wreck who's either lacked socialization, got the wrong genetics or has had bad experiences.

I see no benefit in correcting fear. If my dog is scared of X, and every time she says that X scares her she gets Y, and Y is not pleasant, X is still going to be scary or become scarier because every time she sees X, Y happens.
I'm not against correcting dogs, there are times to do it, but I am against physical corrections for fear based behaviors.

We train every single day, multiple times a day, on every single walk.
We have been unable to find any trainer who will help with the methods that I can agree with, or have been unable to contact the one that I believe can help. So it's just me and will probably always be just me unless we get out of this area.

Dont worry i understand^^
i may have missunderstood something, thats why i did ask like this, when she where an angsty aggressive dog...since bevor you got her who bites when scared it would take an a bit harsher Training, but as you say she does it when she is highstrung from fear after seeing a dog so she takes the treat more or less with a bite...than it Needs an other Approach...more gentle and slow.


i like to face the fear head on....when a horse does fear a mirror in the Arena i ride so Long around till it relaxes with always one calming word...then i go a step near the object that brings fear....till the horse walks around in every direction without looking at the abject or even going to it sniffing it... when ist an object on the ground pawig at it...you also could touch it bevor too when on the ground....
this i alslo put on dogs^^
when a dog is unsure go near it, till you feel ist to much then stop wait relaxe and go away, stop relaxe and start again, step for step inthe direction....sometimes you only go one step each time after a day it can be two or three and so on, till the two Dogs can sit 5meters away from each other or walk with 2-5 meters between them without getting worked up.

it also may help when you walk the other dog and them your dog as it brings a new direction it the Training, some Dogs are also less unsure when walked with colar and not harness or the other way and some go the best free....

you did say you know a fully calm dog....ask them to Train with you...when possible each day

i could try to help with some Training tips but in Dogs im beginner...i onl am good with scared horses and some strangers Dogs that we meet with our Little dog Walking group^^
but when you like it and dont think what i say to stupid i like to help.

but i would try to Train without treats or treats only taken out of a dummy that you can fill with treats...she cant bit you out of stress

to Train her on a calm word/command.... like when she is calm-sleeps-lies near you tell he to relaxe or whatever...with a bit time and always bringing it she lies don and relxed with this word...and you can use it when Training and she gets stressed.

its also good to start traing wiith running or powering out the dog, a fast or Long run on the bike...then a Moment to cool down a bit 5mins with the calming word...and the the Training...and after it an other run- or good Play with something she likes^^ so something nice at beginning and end with a Moment of calm between....and always end the Training on a good Moment, even when ist only one single calm step near the other dog with 10 meters between^^ its always good as it was calm and without stress, or even siting without going crazy^^

a list is also good...like when-how-what-why-who-and so...like when does your dog get nervous, at what Point, what Dogs(big, small, Color...) how many meters have to be between them to stay calm,...seeing or hearing them, has she Trouble seeing, is it all the day or only in the morning-midday or nigh..., is the owner of the other dog a women-man-kid-youth???? and so on...this can give you an view what is the real Problem, who is the best to help at the beginning and so on


Maybe those helps?:

- http://www.nicolewilde.com/how-to-help- ... rful-dogs/
- http://www.whole-dog-journal.com/issues ... 800-1.html
- http://www.clickertraining.com/node/2327

http://shibashake.com/dog/how-to-calm-a ... active-dog
http://www.training-your-dog-and-you.co ... oning.html
http://www.paw-rescue.org/PAW/PETTIPS/DogTip_Shy.php


@ SaraCO2013:
what cute pits

@ to cesar millan:
sure some is not so good, some is good....but i think you have this with all Trainers....andthe Training of animals changes all the time...
take out of it what you think is good and Forget the rest^^ thats like i go at it.....i love his idea with his pack...the running- the giving the dog something to do...i mean a german sheperd can do anything but go crazy when he is always keeped in a small kennel with nothing to do and running around...the same goes for a lot of working Dogs like border collis a lot of People have those in the City and go only on a short walk arount the house...then they wonder why the Dogs bites in the things destroys there home and so....or dont get me started in Husky and malamutes....or herd protection Dogs where thy want 100% obedience....they have there own head because of there work there instinct....i know someone who has an slightly aggressive komodor in a small home and garden....nothing to do no real Walking outside...an not really control over the dog...
i know Trainer who work the Dogs in hard old style, other who only work with gentle touch, other say its the mind of the dog that Needs working and not the Body....and so on...but everybody say theres is the only right...only some use different Training ideas and mixe them for each dog different...
i think the best way to go in all Training, do the best for your animal, as calm as possible, never Anger, never hitting...only when it would be selfdefence, use anything you can read but only the best of it....so even cesar has good things....


so you see anything is possible and usefull

[wolfgirl2011]

Apologies before hand for any snappiness or rudeness. I am genuinely trying to write this all in a calm manner but words can come out wrong.

Epic does not bite when she sees other dogs. She bites when she is stressed/anxious and it's not an actual 'red zone dog' bite as much as a 'quick, get the treats down' that hurts.
She does not get treats for biting, she gets treats for seeing a stimulus that is scary, be it people, kids, dogs or weird things. If she is over threshold we get out of the situation or gain distance, if she is having a decent response, then she is rewarded though more often then not, she will still go after the treats hard.
My dog is not disrespecting me, she's a scared nervous wreck who's either lacked socialization, got the wrong genetics or has had bad experiences.

I see no benefit in correcting fear. If my dog is scared of X, and every time she says that X scares her she gets Y, and Y is not pleasant, X is still going to be scary or become scarier because every time she sees X, Y happens.
I'm not against correcting dogs, there are times to do it, but I am against physical corrections for fear based behaviors.

We train every single day, multiple times a day, on every single walk.
We have been unable to find any trainer who will help with the methods that I can agree with, or have been unable to contact the one that I believe can help. So it's just me and will probably always be just me unless we get out of this area.

This is kind of a late post, but I completely agree with you. My 6 year old Lab mix is completely terrified of men, and he has been since we got him when he was 4 months old. Whenever I would see my dad I would try and work with him to get over his fear, and thankfully he never got bad enough to bite, but he would shake and try to get as far away as he could. At first, I had little to no idea what I was doing, and wasn't working with him correctly; therefore, his fear didn't improve, and got a little worse.
Now, what I do is I bring my dog over to his house with a supply of treats, and good thoughts on my mind. Thankfully, my dad has a dog that has no fear at all and is very helpful in trying to get my dog to come out of his fear phase.

Since then, my dog has gotten a lot better, even to the point of sitting on our couch next to my dad and taking treats from him, but he's still scared, and all I can say is that taking time to do things correctly and giving the dog time is the best thing one can do. Trying to correct a fearful dog will only make them more fearful and could potentially result in a bite.

I'm sorry that you're having problems with Epic, maybe she needs treats with more value? Although I'm sure you've already got pretty good treats. And I'm sure you've tried this, but try presenting her with the scent of another dog, maybe on a cloth, and then trying to get her attention on you instead. The second she looks you in the eyes or even looks at you, give her a treat. As she continues to do this, incorporate the sounds of dogs, and eventually sight. <-- I work at my local humane society and we have reactive dogs all over, and it doesn't help that they're stuck from getting to the other dogs. However, we use this technique and have used it successfully in the past.
Good luck!

[rose.bloom]

So, to all of you who have gotten your Novice Trick Dog rank, what tricks did you teach? If I'm understanding correctly, requirements for Novice Trick Dog is fifteen points [Fifteen tricks but advanced tricks count as to.]. What tricks are considered "advanced" and what are considered "beginner".

I'm probably going to need lots of guidance as Gretta is an extremely naughty and hard to train dog.