Redwood Valley Equestrian Centre || Discussion

[iStarz & Everly]

I like that idea. I have a couple mares myself that i would like a round of foals from to see who drops the best baby with the chosen sire. It’s hard to do otherwise as it takes quite a long time.

[SydneyandStorm]

In that case, I'll look into it further ^^ It may be a little bit before I can get to finalizing how it will work but if it would be helpful then I'm happy to see about it! c:

[SydneyandStorm]

Hi, all ^^ Sorry to double-post, but I wanted to make sure everyone saw this and had the opportunity to respond.

With regard to color imports, would you guys rather that the qualifications be changed to say that you can hand-pick one or turn on two of the import's alleles instead of just having to describe a coat color that you hope is permissible for imports, since the rules are kind of hard to follow? Of course, if you are not familiar with genetics, you can still just specify what basic color you want or something; we can come up with a solution to that as well. Going through the imports section, I really hate how confusing it is for those who import color horses and have to constantly guess at what will be considered okay.

Being able to hand-pick the alleles for one gene would mean that you could, for example, import a horse that will always produce black or bay foals (EE), that is some type of double-cream (CrCr) or pearl (prlprl or prlCr), will always pass on PATN to his or her foals (PATN-1PATN-1), or will sometimes pass champagne but sometimes not (Chch), for example. This means that you would have no control over the actual look of the base coat (because double-cream could be acting on bay, black, or chestnut, for example, and you wouldn't get to choose which one; you could also end up with a horse with a modifier you didn't want to have, such as selecting EE for black but getting a dark buckskin horse through random cream and agouti) but you would have absolute control over how a horse would pass on that part of his or her genetic code to offspring and over at least one part of the horse's color.

Being able to turn two genes on or off would mean that you could, for example, choose to turn the E gene "on" and the T gene "on" so that you are guaranteed a black-based tobiano. You wouldn't have any control over whether or not a horse was homozygous for a gene, which means that trying to import a palomino could wind up with you getting a cremello because you would have to turn the cream gene "on" but couldn't stop it at "Crcr" while also turning "off" E (so that you could start with a chestnut), but you would have a little more control over how your horse looks this way and be able to import a color and a pattern at the same time, which has not been previously allowed with imports.

Of course, if you like the idea but don't understand genetics well enough to feel comfortable ordering an import this way, you can always shoot me a PM and I can help you out ^^ This also would not change import colors or patterns being restricted by the import breed's actual gene pool.

I don't know... I don't want to make the system more complicated by making it less complicated, but at the same time, I don't want users to agonize over what colors and patterns are allowed and which ones are not whenever they go to purchase a color import. It's just kind of difficult trying to regulate colors and patterns so that RVEC doesn't get overrun and all and they all drop in value without making it harder on color importers. What do you guys think? <3

[iStarz & Everly]

I like the two gene way, as ive been trying to introduce more patterns and colorations into TWH, ive been resorting to crossbreeding, and trying to get back to a pure strain, which takes up a lot of time, with potentially havibg big rewards if i can keep the color/pattern there.

[caf.]

great input, all of you - i greatly appreciate it! i'll try my best to address all of your points here.

first off, as a small note, game currency may not be the only prize offered for invitationals. in the past, Sydney has hinted at semi-customs or customs being offered to winners (if you'd like to jump in here, Syd, and correct me or update us, please do!), and i'm sure we'll both be doing our best to make the competitions very exciting and rewarding.

so there's the problem, then - in order for an invitational to run, six horses from at least two different users need to enter. this is relatively easy for semi-popular disciplines like hunters and eventing, but more difficult for very popular disciplines like jumpers due to their high level of difficulty and for unpopular disciplines like cutting and marathon driving. as such, my goal is to make the invitationals easy to enter to encourage owners to dive in, while still keeping the challenge and whimsy that made them exciting in the first place. the question, then, is after entering their horses in several competitions until they achieved a qualifying score, then shelling out as much as 1,000c for an entry, how much more will owners do before feeling like the prize doesn't justify the work?

i debate on the requirement. it seems to me that, if owners that completed prompts if they weren't required were given a large bonus in competition, it'd be enough incentive to at least most owners to go ahead and try them. however, i can also see that not working if enough owners decide not to bother with the prompts.

it seems that most everyone is in agreement with the low word limit, so it's likely that will be implemented in the not too far future. you bring up a good point, OutFoxed, about effort being rewarded, but unfortunately i'm not sure if that's possible the way it stands. being the show steward myself, i don't think it would be fair at all for me to judge the entries, and the entire point of my taking over the shows was to give Sydney more time for other matters, so i don't think it'd be fair to delegate it to her either. of course, a good compromise would be a 'special bonus' offered to truly exceptional entrants, while the rest receives the standard bonus provided they met the requirements. that'd still have to be on a case-by-case basis, but is it perhaps more acceptable?

you're very right on the prompts - i found that a challenge myself with my entries. perhaps i can delete the prompts relating to riders and try to come up with more that are specific to the horse?

the great thing about invitationals is that they do not run alongside regular shows - if the show fills in the middle of the week, so be it, the show runs (provided i'm around to do it, of course). of course, if it happens to fill close to the entry closing date of the schooling shows, i'll just run it with them, no big deal. does that make sense? currently, i don't feel like invitationals are terribly time-sensitive - with so few qualifications, there's no great rush to enter. this could change, of course, but for now does that seem fair? i have an incredibly busy show schedule this season, so i'm trying to run shows as often as humanly possible while i still have the time, but they will start slowing down as i start my spring season.

edit: as for the separate threads, i very much invite players to create their own threads/google docs/etc. in which to store entries to avoid clogging the thread, but i'd rather keep all show material in the same place. if a new thread is highly in favor, though, i'll certainly consider it!

i hope everything i've said makes sense! my apologies for any typos, i'm thinking out loud and typing on my phone, aha. let me know what y'all think!

i hate to be a bother and bringvthis up again, but i've got plenty of time now to work out kinks with invitationals and would love to get any updates completed very soon! any additional thoughts on this matter?

[caf.]

Hello everyone! SydneyandStorm has given me permission to unveil a set of very exciting updates concerning the competitions!

Regional competitions are higher-level shows for horses that are ready to move up from the schooling level. Like schooling shows, they run as soon as they fill with at least 3 horses owned by two different owners. Horses may enter regionals ages 5-25, with the same rules applying to injuries that apply to schooling shows.

In order to enter a regional show, a horse must have won a competition in the desired discipline at some point in its career. Unlike invitational qualifications, regional qualifications do not expire; thus, a horse can theoretically move to the regional level for the rest of its career if its owner so chooses. Additionally, horses that place first or second in a futurity are automatically eligible for regional shows. However, keep in mind that a horse cannot enter a regional show and a schooling show of the same discipline during one show cycle. Thus, owners should consider whether a horse has a good chance of being successful at regionals.

Entry fees for regional shows are higher, but so are the payouts; regionals can be very lucrative for competitive stables. Prizes and entry fees for regional shows are double that of schooling shows. Be sure to include proof of your horse’s qualification in the entry form by linking to a show results post in which your horse won a schooling show class or took champion/reserve champion in a futurity.

Regional Competition FAQs

Will regional competitions replace invitationals?
Not at all! Regionals were devised as a means to add variety and difficulty to RVEC competitions on a regular basis without increasing the frequency of invitationals. Invitationals will run periodically, whenever enough horses qualify.

Are there any changes to invitationals coming along with the regionals update?
Horses may qualify for invitationals through schooling or regional competitions. As it is more difficult to achieve a qualifying score at the regional level, it is slightly easier to enter horses who qualified at the regional level. Owners of horses who qualified through schooling shows must submit a designated written prompt along with their entry form. Owners of horses who qualified through regional shows need only submit their entry form.

What will happen with my invitational entries?
Nothing at all! Invitationals will still happen in the not-too-distant future, but until then your entries will remain valid. If, however, you would like to scratch and put those entry fees towards regionals, you’re more than welcome to PM me (caf.) and I’ll remove the entries from the sheet.

How do I enter a regional competition?
At this time, no regional show form exists; as such, please use the schooling show form, and edit the title of the form to read 'Regional Show Registration' instead. When entering, you must attach somewhere in your registration proof of the horse's qualification for regionals - a link to a show results post in which the horse wins a schooling show class of the desired discipline, or places first or second in a futurity of that specialty.

Which horses are qualified for regional competitions?
(note - i have only listed the earliest qualification for each horse, but you are welcome to list a more recent qualification if you wish!)

Hunters:
Darcy’s Chase / Hunters / 1/23/17
Lunar Exploration / Hunters / 7/22/17
Lionheart / Hunters / 1/5/18
Hollywood Hunk FS / Hunters / 1/21/18

Jumpers:
Beyond The Lines / Jumpers / 9/17/16
Over And Out / Jumpers / 6/19/17
A Story of Hope / Jumpers / 12/22/17
Himmlischer Tanz / Jumpers / 1/5/18
Starwalker’s It Feels Good To Be Alive Right Now / Jumpers / 1/21/18
CC Ghoulish Graverobber / Jumpers / 1/29/18

Cross-Country:
Insomniac Dreams / Cross-Country / 11/2/16
SSS Guns ‘n’ Rosettes / Cross-Country / 12/24/16
Beyond The Lines / Cross-Country / 1/7/17
La Paso Fiesta / Cross-Country / 7/22/17
GentleGalantis / Cross-Country / 8/10/17
Beat The Gun / Cross-Country / 9/22/17
Moonlit Waters / Cross-Country / 9/22/17
CwC Making Headlines / Cross-Country / 10/6/17

Dressage:
Over Olympus / Dressage / 9/18/16
Attentive / Dressage / 10/9/16
Mind The Rosette / Dressage / 12/24/16
Above All Loss / Dressage / 6/19/17\
Perpetuum Jazzile / Dressage / 8/10/17
Guadalupe Groove / Dressage / 8/21/17

Eventing:
Over Olympus / Eventing / 9/18/16
Beyond The Lines / Eventing / 10/13/16
Above All Loss / Eventing / 12/19/16
Perpetuum Jazzile / Eventing / 7/22/17
The Winter Sea / Eventing / 8/21/17
Moonlit Waters / Eventing /1/5/18

Western Pleasure:
Arrow Through Your Neck Who Missed The Crimson Apple / Western Pleasure / 10/13/16
Noble Cause / Western Pleasure / 11/15/16
CwC Beyond Condition / Western Pleasure / 7/31/17
Guadalupe Groove / Western Pleasure / 8/21/17
Fatal Attraction / Western Pleasure / 10/6/17
CwC Poseidon’s Gift / Western Pleasure / 1/5/18
CwC Zig and Zag / Western Pleasure / 1/29/18

Reining:
Embracing The Fear / Reining / 10/10/16
Noble Cause / Reining / 11/14/16
American Gothic / Reining / 12/25/16
Remember Me / Reining / 2/17/17
Orchard Rush / Reining / 7/22/17
Lunar Exploration / Reining / 8/10/17
CwC Little Toy Guns / Reining / 8/21/17
Coded Whisper / Reining / 1/21/18

Barrel Racing:
Lost On A Trail / Barrel Racing / 11/14/16
A Drop Of Faith / Barrel Racing / 12/18/16
The Flip Side / Barrel Racing / 12/25/16
Hometown Memories / Barrel Racing / 5/13/18

Working Cow Horse:
CwC Perpetual Distance / Working Cow Horse / 1/5/18
CwC Switching Loyalties / Working Cow Horse / 1/21/18

Carriage Driving:
Highland Rose / Carriage Driving / 1/21/18
Smoke Inhalation / Carriage Driving / 1/29/18

Driven Dressage:
Guadalupe Groove / Driven Dressage / 1/5/18
Noble Cause / Driven Dressage / 1/19/18

Combined Driving:
Objective Affection / Combined Driving / 1/21/18

Performance halter is an in-hand discipline that calls for balanced, structurally sound horses geared towards riding or driving. No accessories are required to compete, nor are there any age restrictions - horses as young as weanlings and as old as thirty are welcome in the discipline. Competing horses should be strong in all stats, with a good attitude and particular strength in stats desired by their breed standard.

Performance halter does count as an official discipline; therefore, it does count to each horse's limit* of two competitions per cycle.

Performance Halter FAQs

*What is the current competition limit?
While the competition page appears to list three, and it may have been three before this post, due to the difficulty of the new updates the limit for the foreseeable future is two competitions per cycle.

How exactly is performance halter judged?
Performance halter is significantly different from other disciplines. Explained succinctly, horses are judged on four qualities: balance, structure, quality, and muscling.
Balanced horses are strong in their necks, shoulders, barrels, and hindquarters. Balance accounts for 30% of a horse's score.
Structurally sound horses are strong in their shoulders, forelegs, barrels, hindquarters, hind legs, feet, and action. Structure accounts for 40% of a horse's score.
Quality horses are strong in their heads, necks, coats, action, and three other stats determined by their type**. Quality accounts for 15% of a horse's score.
Muscling is determined by training. It accounts for 15% of a horse's score.
Performance halter scores are percentages out of 100, 100% being a theoretical perfect score. Most foundation horses score in the fifties or sixties. A random penalty of -5 to +5 -2 to 2 points is assigned to each horse to reflect judging bias.

**How does a horse's type play into judging?
Along with head, neck, coat, and action, three other stats play into the judging of a horse's quality. These three stats are dependent on a horse's type.
Baroque horses should be strong in their necks, barrels, and hind legs.
Draft horses should be strong in their chests, hindquarters, and action.
Gaited horses should be strong in their heads, forelegs, and action.
Ponies should be strong in their heads, forelegs, and hind legs.
Sporthorses should be strong in their shoulders, forelegs, and barrels.
Stockhorses should be strong in their forelegs, hindquarters, and hind legs.
Note the following concessions:
- Quarter ponies are judged as stockhorses.
- Arabian horses are judged as sporthorses.
- Sport ponies are judged as sporthorses.
- Feral horses are judged as stockhorses.
Grade horses will be judged as the type that makes up the majority of their bloodline. If there is no majority, the horse will take the type of its sire.

Why is there no gender bonus in performance halter?
Halter, as a discipline, is generally meant to judge breeding stock; as such, geldings would actually tend to be disadvantaged. For the purposes of keeping gelding viable and lucrative, geldings are simply judged on a level playing field as mares and stallions.

Are there regional/invitational competitions for performance halter?
There are most certainly performance halter regionals, though keep in mind that they are restricted to horses age 5-25 as is standard for other regionals. Invitationals are still up in the air, as a qualifying score has yet to be designated.

When performance halter is introduced, will my horses’ previous wins in halter/showmanship qualify it for regionals in that discipline?
Unfortunately, no; since performance halter is judged differently than halter/showmanship was, the two disciplines aren’t truly comparable. However, the discipline is expected to run frequently when it is introduced, so quality horses should move up quickly to regionals.

An age bonus has been implemented in all disciplines in order to combat the current trend in competitions of older horses beating down their younger counterparts due to high training. Horses older than 19 will receive a small penalty. This bonus may or may not become more complex in the future.

All changes are in effect immediately. Show entries are now open for all divisions.

[OutFoxed]

.edit.

[iStarz & Everly]

@caf.

If i wanted to switch entries for horses in this show round to regionals (as i apparently have a lot of qualifiers, i mind as well give it a go) do we just mark for the regional shows next to their name and take the extra fee out, or should i redo my whole entry form post?

And what would be the price for regionals?

[caf.]

if you just mark the regional entries clearly, i’m perfectly okay with that! the regional entry fee is double that of schooling shows - 200c for single disciplines, 300c for combined ones.

[iStarz & Everly]

awesome thank you, just got to change my bank quick and it should be all set.