operation p.a.w. ;; don't let the howls stop

[[ Tabbi ]]

No, no, no. They only kill if they are highly threatened! They will attack if they are attacked, or starving. And if they are starving, guess who's fault that it is? Right-o, us. And I never saidthey're cuddly and gental. But, they don't prefer attacking, they have feelings to and those feelings don't tell them to attack. Only if threatened will wolves attack, and that's a fact.

[starfred24]

I agree with both of you, wolves are timid but will attack if attacked

[van]

No, no, no. They only kill if they are highly threatened! They will attack if they are attacked, or starving. And if they are starving, guess who's fault that it is? Right-o, us. And I never saidthey're cuddly and gental. But, they don't prefer attacking, they have feelings to and those feelings don't tell them to attack. Only if threatened will wolves attack, and that's a fact.

and what do you have to back up this 'fact'...?
wolves may attack if they feel threatened, are overly hungry, feel as though their food source is threatened, are sick or injured, they lose their fear of humans, or otherwise. wolves are territorial animals, and as with all animals that establish a set territory, they will defend it. while they generally won't 'defend' territory from humans, wolves have been known to see humans as a threat to them or their food supply, or mistook a human for prey.
a wolf can and will attack. granted, wolf attacks on humans are rare, it can and has happened.

and it's not necessarily our fault if a wolf is starving. it could be due to disease, overpopulation, or other natural things. but of course, if no effort is taken to reduce the population of wolves, harsh starvation will occur. but we as humans do what we can for the most part.

and yes, i'm not saying they're bloodthirsty killers or anything, just that wolf attacks have happened, and chances are they will continue to happen.

[[ Tabbi ]]

Finally, I'm begining to agree with you. "Wolf attacks on humans are rare," "and yes, i'm not saying they're bloodthirsty killers or anything." Yes, and very yes.

But, I do just love it when you say "if no effort is taken to reduce the population of wolves, harsh starvation will occur. but we as humans do what we can for the most part."

That's quite rediculous!! Humans should never, I say never, be killing wolves to "reduce the population!" [color=#FF0000]-removed- because the human popoulation is far, far more "overpopulated" then the wolf population. If we as humans didn't eat everything we could to live, we would be starving. Wolves themselves are faily "underpopulated", but in reality almost every species is compared to humans.

And if wolves are starving, it is because of us. We, as humans, are the ones stealing their territory to build cities, homes, factories, resorts, anything. We are one of the causes of starvation in animals.


Also, I love the fact that some of your stamps say "I'd love to hunt wolves." When this thread would like to stop that.[/color]

[van]

just a friendly reminder that this thread is to prevent the extinction of wolves and save wolves from extinction. legal, regulated hunting is helpful to wolves and benefits them.

[sweater]

I've been sitting in my little corner for the majority of this conversation but I need to say something.
Everyone else covered a lot of this, so I'm not going to repeat what's already been said. I'm just going to skip to the end.
Wolf attacks on humans are rare, though not impossible. It has happened before, and it's happened enough times for us to realize, "Dang, wolves can kill!" It doesn't matter how often a wolf attacks a human, it's the fact that they can kill a human which leads us to believe they are all killing machines. While they are not all like that all the time, they are very capable of acting like wild, savage beasts because they kind of are. It's just how nature works; if they weren't like this, wolves would be extinct. It's just the truth.

...Whoever thinks that wolf population is to large should go and shoot themself right now...

Don't even joke about that. No one should be even told to kill themselves because they have an opinion! Does that mean you should go shoot yourself because you don't think wolf population is too large? Of course not! So please, please don't use that term, as it is highly offensive.
Like Van said, it's beneficial to wolves to keep their population down - as long as its all legal. The government {for the most part} is a smart group of people and wouldn't legalize regulated wolf hunting if they didn't realize how helpful it is.

...We, as humans, are the ones stealing their territory to build cities, homes, factories, resorts, anything...

We are not stealing their territory; they don't really own it. While I do believe the wolves deserve land, we can't just give them the area we need to keep a settled community going. We need the space, as do they, but we aren't doing it because we want to or we just feel like it. We're doing it because we need the land. There have been cases were we tear down wolf territory so we can build settlements that are not necessary, but for the most part I believe we have good reason to use the land. In my opinion, there should be more enclosed areas just for wolves that we cannot tear down and use the other territory to build what we need. Just my opinion, though. There's lots of downsides to that, as well.
Van can have whatever stamps he/she wants for it is his/her opinion and if he/she wants to hunt wolves, fine. Just because you're against it doesn't mean it's a fact that wolf hunting is bad. I will probably never hunt wolves because I'm vegetarian that dislikes the whole concept of hunting, {the thought of even wielding a gun scares me}, but I do think that wolf hunting is actually useful to all of us, both for the wolves and humans, in the long run. The world would be a lot different of a place if responsible wolf hunting had not been legalized.
Good day to you all, I shall return to my corner of shame for now.
-Sona

[Thestormwitch]

Finally, I'm begining to agree with you. "Wolf attacks on humans are rare," "and yes, i'm not saying they're bloodthirsty killers or anything." Yes, and very yes.

But, I do just love it when you say "if no effort is taken to reduce the population of wolves, harsh starvation will occur. but we as humans do what we can for the most part."

That's quite rediculous!! Humans should never, I say never, be killing wolves to "reduce the population!" [color=#FF0000]-removed- because the human popoulation is far, far more "overpopulated" then the wolf population. If we as humans didn't eat everything we could to live, we would be starving. Wolves themselves are faily "underpopulated", but in reality almost every species is compared to humans.

And if wolves are starving, it is because of us. We, as humans, are the ones stealing their territory to build cities, homes, factories, resorts, anything. We are one of the causes of starvation in animals.


Also, I love the fact that some of your stamps say "I'd love to hunt wolves." When this thread would like to stop that.[/color]

Did hekomi write all that? All that is totally what I've been saying all along! thank you!

[van]

komi just removed the offensive part, i'm pretty sure.
but although humans technically aren't overpopulated and a lot of scientists are saying that we are just increasing our carrying capacity [though it depends on your opinion i guess], i agree that we may do a lot of damage or cause damage. however, i don't see how this justifies making the wolves suffer due to overpopulation.

[rabbithaver]

so i signed up awhile ago when i had a different username and i've been stalking this thread off and on for awhile now. i share a view similar to Van's in that i love wolves but i also support wolf hunting in places where the population is getting to be too big for the habitat to sustain it. there's one thing that people say that bugs me a lot. i think it should be brought to attention.
when arguing against hunting for overpopulation, saying 'humans are overpopulated' is irrelevant. in what alternate universe is the government going to pass a law to hunt humans? human 'overpopulation' isn't the main problem here.

also, just an idea here: instead of debating about wolf hunting, why not compromise? we can never fully eliminate wolf hunting, but perhaps if we go an alternate route, we can lessen the need for it. there's many places wolves can thrive peacefully, but not a lot of support for relocation efforts to get the animals out of overpopulated areas and into these places. perhaps instead of trying to prevent wolf hunting altogether, it would do some good to refocus our attention to something we can all support?

i apologise if what i said isn't very clear D: i didn't get a whole lot of sleep last night and i've got a cold so my thoughts are a bit muddled.

[starfred24]

Well, actually, wolves aren't overpopulated, they're endangered which makes me upset (wolves are my favourite animal) they're endangered because humans hunt them and destroy their habitat.