"The" Rares List Guide - Do not ask about new UR's!

[DaDwarf]

Just to add, this list is made by users for users. There is no way in telling if our information is correct and by counting out all pets and all trades, that still wouldn't reflect the worth of pets, even with algorithmic. Demand is something that changes every day, and it's different for every person. No math mathematical solution can be found for that, i'd say.

Trading is what makes CS fun and interesting (For me :3). If we have a system put in place that will tell us exactly what would be fair, wouldn't that make trading more difficult, even more difficult then it already is right now?

It's a nice idea, but not something for on CS, i can't see how it would work ^.^

edit;

sometimes the "value" of a pet seems to be depending on a small group of people

Just wanted to add that this isn't true. Just because a small group of people post on this thread do not mean that we set value. Things on the list are that away because they were traded that way before they got added.

[jinx**]

I don't really see any privacy issues there. The data could be absolutely anonymous and since ALL trades are included this should be no problem at all (not only trades from a subset of users).

Nick does not need to publish any statistical data directly. He could include some scripts/programs that run automatically to build some kind of rarity list. You will never know what person traded which pets and so on...

Plus: Since the mean data will be calculated overpay, underpay and gifts won't be that problematic. Most trades are fair with equal value and that's the points where the scripts/programs will be based on. The real trades says what is fair and what isn't.

So if everybody would pay overpay for a special pet over the last 12 months, they do not overpay, they just trade fair and your view of the pet is just underestimated. THAT'S how the real value of a pet should be calculated. Please remember that first-month overpaying for special pets won't effect this mean value not really, since only 1 out of 12 months is just counting 1/12

@DaDwarf: You are right. The list is made by users for users, but just by a couple of users... That's my main problem. I don't see that everybody has the chance to include his input into the list, even if he might be correct with his statement.

[Hekomi]

I am always willing to take multiple user's input on things. To be quite frank, I don't see how an algorithm could help, and it really seems like a huge hassle. Trying to get everyone's trades in order to calculate it would be nearly impossible and I honestly see if being more trouble than it's worth. While I really appreciate the help and ideas, I'm more interested in working on the gap list and point system to help users with their pets and trading. Maybe that would be something that could be looked at in the future, but right now I don't think it's a plausible solution. If you have ideas or input you'd like to make on pet values, please let us know, I'm more than happy to hear it.

[DaDwarf]

@DaDwarf: You are right. The list is made by users for users, but just by a couple of users... That's my main problem. I don't see that everybody has the chance to include his input into the list, even if he might be correct with his statement.

Everybody who feels like something needs to be altered on the list is welcome to post. There is no restriction in who can and can't post. All we ask is to provide proof :3 If one person says for example..the dog tag is going for less then yellow toxics, because they have traded their dogtag for just a yellow toxic, then that is not what actually happens on the whole site, but just happened to that one person.

Now say, same example, but 20 people show us different trades made at different times (Show or we find em ourselves xD), that will make us reconsider the position of the pet on the list.

In short, if one user comes in with one or more trades claiming a pet needs to be moved, we won't unless we find out it's generally accepted by the majority of CS users. Aka more trades, more opinions, by more people.

[vvoland]

On the whole algorithm issue

But honestly, DD is right. Having something that tells you exactly what is fair, and exactly what isn't just doesn't seem to be CS. You make your own choices, and with everything being exact, that takes away five years of CS tradition, and... Things like that.

And you know what? If input is right, and they haven't thought about that aspect, they consider it. And if you notice, a lot of input is not valid. There is a reason all the discussion goes on. And there are few users who know as much about rarities as the makers of this thread.

[Hekomi]

And while I know a lot of users don't like this list because it can take the fun away from trading [it's a common complaint] I think an algorithm would make this even worse, unfortunately. It's a great idea and I love that you'd like to make one for us, but it may be more trouble and hardship than it's worth.

[Azuri]

the problem is if it is anonomus, it could be called stealing data, and if someone doesn't want to be included this violates privacy laws, ulitmately leading to CS being sued or shut down, if you don't want a trade to be shown, using it is like using, where most people are located on cs (where their IP adress is)

Everything involing mulipule users has to be volentary, this is not like a court case where withholding information is a crime

(My closest friend is a law major, the taking of data is a serious fellony)


to clarify you give concent to cs to know your ip address when you sign up, it violates terms and condisions to track a users trades if you have no reason to beleive they are cheating, the trades can only be veiwed by admins for this perpose

I do admit if this was probable it is a good idea, it simply is not

[cαkε]

Can I just say you can quickly found out who was participating in a trade's link.

since you can find the ID of the user through the trade.

[jinx**]

the problem is if it is anonomus, it could be called stealing data, and if someone doesn't want to be included this violates privacy laws, ulitmately leading to CS being sued or shut down, if you don't want a trade to be shown, using it is like using, where most people are located on cs (where their IP adress is)

Everything involing mulipule users has to be volentary, this is not like a court case where withholding information is a crime

(My closest friend is a law major, the taking of data is a serious fellony)


to clarify you give concent to cs to know your ip address when you sign up, it violates terms and condisions to track a users trades if you have no reason to beleive they are cheating, the trades can only be veiwed by admins for this perpose

I do admit if this was probable it is a good idea, it simply is not

I guess you are completely wrong with the idea I had... I do not want to connect to CS or do whatever you said. I want CS to output the list directly. They already own the data, they already read and manage the data (rarity is calculated in the same way). So nothing will ever change in any privacy law... Do you understand now?

And well... I know that the list is already taking fun sometimes while trading pets away, because they are some pets on the list that has value X but in the real world you will never get this value (but since it has value X you really do not want to trade it away for less than X). The automatically calculated list won't do anything else, but more specific.

A new idea:

Perhaps that is the wrong way at all... But Blizzardclaw give me another idea of a solution for this issue. Perhaps we should split the rarity in more parts. That is one of the most problems in CS, because lots of VR pets differs A LOT in rarity, but are all VR. Perhaps splitting rarity in 7 steps, we could add some more (especially in the upper half of the rarity chart) - One or Two more should do it...

My main intention was to make the VR pets trade a bit more clear, because here CS has the biggest issues. Almost all list and lots of non-list pets are VR, but they will be handled absolutely different and that may be totally strange for a lot of users...

[Azuri]

I greatly wish we could split up rarities, but that is up to Nick and tess


I find that it would help alot