New Rule: DNI (Do Not Interact) Lists are Banned

[Aaron✦]

i think this was a good call to make. honestly, i had never considered before the possibility of banning DNI lists, but now that you've laid it all out, it actually makes a lot of sense. after reading bits and pieces of this thread, i think a lot of those who are getting upset forget that chickensmoothie always has and always will be aimed toward younger audiences, and their first priority is to keep children safe. i rarely see anything child-friendly on DNI lists. if this upsets you, then perhaps you should not be spending time on a website aimed toward younger audiences and children, and find another site that better fits your expectations.

[removed]

to get a bit anecdotal, i am a person with a trigger that isn't horribly common but pops up every once in a while. it stems from a fear so intense that i cannot even say what i'm afraid of beyond the actual phobia name. since i am so obviously terrified of something—the mention of which requires me to undergo various obsessive-compulsive "cleansing rituals" to ensure i don't get "cursed" and gives me unwelcome thoughts and flashbacks—why would i openly advertise that fear/trigger on a DNI list? why would i open myself up to potential attacks if i get on someone's bad side? it's like painting a big red target on your chest and letting people know exactly how to make you upset. why would you want the world to know your biggest vulnerabilities?

as i saw someone mention earlier, the internet is not a safe space. it is ridiculous for me to expect people to tiptoe around me and watch their words online. you need to take responsibility for yourself and understand that you cannot go through life avoiding things. as someone with anxiety, it's an unfortunate truth. but when i come across that trigger or something else that bothers me? i block them if necessary, do my little rituals, and move on. will i unwillingly think about it for a while? yes. will it ruin my life? probably not. it's not difficult to hit that block button and move on with your life. why would anyone want to give another person so much power over them by getting so upset and worked up and dwelling on it? it's just not a good way to live.

it's one thing sharing your triggers and things that make you uncomfortable among close friends or small servers or groups with like-minded people. it's another to put it on a list and lay it out on the internet for anyone to see. but you can never fully guarantee if a person you are interacting with fit your DNI criteria or not. people can lie. people can omit things. it may never get brought up. if you find out a person belongs to a fandom you don't like... just block them and move on. it really isn't that serious. and if the thought of potentially coming across people who are on your DNI criteria get you that upset and worked up, then it might be best to step away from the internet and focus on yourself for a little bit. no one is forcing you to be on this site or to interact with these people. if you don't like how things are handled, you have the power to walk away.

[Montgomery Gator]

I had no idea such things as DNIs even existed until today. I am a bit dumbfounded how anyone could think them useful at all.I think them rather silly and mostly rude so I agree with the rule. In any case though, it is a decision the staff made and that is that.

If you really need to shield yourself from your triggers there are other ways. For example, people who require messages with their trades often make me incredibly anxious, yet there is no rule against requiring such a message. So I usually just c/p some "can't communicate" info over,if that is not message enough it's their problem.

Instead of a list,you could just politely ask not to bother you with the species you don't want to see or the issues you can't talk about. If they violate the rule and pester you, it is a matter for staff to deal with.

Excluding anyone based on their interest, on the other side, is not only rude, it is also a form of bullying in my view. I deeply dislike some sports or most anime, yet it would never occur to me to block people from interacting with me because they like those things.

i 100% agree with this

[Aaron✦]

I'm gonna say I mostly agree with this new rule. There isn't much I can say against DNIs that hasn't been stated by other users already, so I'll try my best not to parrot others too much.

Honestly DNIs don't always bother me I can kinda see why someone would want one. I have even considered having one myself at times. Basically it would've gone like: "DNI if you are going to be disrespectful to me or my friends..." but sadly in reality this wouldn't really work, and I would either get as much trouble from rude people as if I didn't have one or possibly more because now they know they now how much it would bother me. As a person suffering from mental illness I can understand why someone who has anxiety, paranoia etc. would want one of these because it creates a feeling of security, but the sad truth is it's probably doing the opposite for you because listing personal info publicly, and online for that matter is incredibly unsafe and always has been from the early days of internet. [removed] Also for those who don't know you can disable peoples signatures in your settings, it can reduce the risk of seeing something triggering in someone's signatures.

On another note, I would like to mention that I myself have been triggered by DNIs. One of the reasons why I'm glad they're being banned from this website. Wether I am on CS or on another site I try my best to respect others' boundaries but at one point I was getting triggered so much it started to happen daily (sometimes even more than once in one day) and I had to stop. I fixed this by doing this: when going into another person's profile I would look at the corner of the screen, that way I can't really read the words but I can tell how long something is. If someone's DNI was too long/specific I simply leave their profile, I left without getting triggered or disrespecting their boundaries. I've been doing this for a while now and my mental health has been better because of this trick.

I know many will disagree with me on this specific opinion I'm about to state but I strongly disagree with putting fandoms in your DNI. It's perfectly ok to dislike a certain media, everyone has a right to their own opinion. But using that against someone because they might be toxic about it is kind of insulting, to be honest. It's highly unlikely because someone with a signature/profile pic that has a picture relating to THAT particular fandom that you absolutely cannot stand but is reaching out to you for a completely unrelated reason is going to throw you into the most horrible part of that fandom the second you reply to them. And so what if they end up wanting to be your friend? 99% of my friends and family is into fandoms that I hate so much it makes me want to punch a hole into a wall in anger but I'm still talking to them, and having good times with them! We just talk about stuff we can relate on. If a person starts getting toxic about their interests then block. If they start harassing/bullying you over such a thing, block and report. But until that happens, please just try and give a chance. Also to those who say "I block these fandoms because their creators have done something I don't agree with" I don't think there is even ONE CREATOR in this entire world who hasn't done at least one sus thing in their time. There are entire articles on wikipedia about the hundreds of shady things the Walt Disney Company has done in the past. It's been stated before but art becomes separate from artist at certain points, and even though the artist has done something the fans highly disapprove of still can enjoy the art. There are so many reasons why someone would want to not interact with someone else, but someones likes/dislikes shouldn't be one of them.

These are my thoughts on this matter, and I realize this choice CS staff made doesn't cater to everyone. So I hope the people who are struggling this new change find some new, safer form of coping mechanism. I want the best for everyone on this site. If you disagree with any of the statements I have made above, you are free to object or even block my account I will have no hard feelings. If any of the statements I have made above are incorrect in any way, I highly encourage someone to correct me on it. If I have said something wrong I highly encourage someone from staff to let me know (preferably via PM).

I wish anyone reading this - regardless of wether you agree or disagree with anything I have said - a pleasant day/night. <3 <3 <3

[cuddlewuffle]

on the whole i think the takeaway should be that those who like & enjoy DNI lists are valid, it's just not something that is well-suited for this site

like i think it should be viewed as a logistical thing first and foremost, and although mods have presented it that way i don't think a lot of people are viewing it like that

DNI lists on huge social media sites (you know the ones) that have automated modding, with lax rules and things that fly under the radar frequently and often: makes sense, not a strain on moderators because moderators are very rarely personally handling reports, and there are only a handful of rules to moderate by (no hate speech, no graphic content, again you know the ones) so DNI lists would almost never come up in a report

DNI lists on a small pet-collecting game with public forums, largely manual modding, with strict rules and few things that fly under the radar: logistical nightmare. real human mods have to go through every single report, and with all of the secondary rules that CS has (no personal info, no blacklists of specific users, etc.) both passive & active moderation of DNI lists to make sure that they ALL abide by CS's other rules, in addition to regularly tightening guidelines to find ways around loopholes that users will inevitably find (true for any rule that exists, people will always try to find work-arounds): it's not realistic or reasonable.

the workload for a mod on CS- who is obligated to moderate this site in accordance to the strict rules that make it the safe place we all know it as- is MUCH higher than the workload for a mod of a site that lets way more things fly.

a DNI list on a different website could allow way more on it than what could be mentioned on a DNI list on CS, which means that many people making or linking their lists on CS that they use for every other website = more reports and moderations to be dealt with.

CS mods are allowed to think of their time as valuable, just like everyone else's.

there are probably things that would make us all more comfortable on here (besides DNI lists) that are just simply not allowed because of the other rules; it's just a fact of using this website and that's okay!

[Zeena]

I had no idea such things as DNIs even existed until today. I am a bit dumbfounded how anyone could think them useful at all.I think them rather silly and mostly rude so I agree with the rule. In any case though, it is a decision the staff made and that is that.

If you really need to shield yourself from your triggers there are other ways. For example, people who require messages with their trades often make me incredibly anxious, yet there is no rule against requiring such a message. So I usually just c/p some "can't communicate" info over,if that is not message enough it's their problem.

Instead of a list,you could just politely ask not to bother you with the species you don't want to see or the issues you can't talk about. If they violate the rule and pester you, it is a matter for staff to deal with.

Excluding anyone based on their interest, on the other side, is not only rude, it is also a form of bullying in my view. I deeply dislike some sports or most anime, yet it would never occur to me to block people from interacting with me because they like those things.

Yes. Especially the last paragraph.
I'm generally pretty open to anything or at least willing to consider said thing, however, saying that "because you are part of this group/like this thing, I won't even consider that we could be friends", is super upsetting to me and reeks of entitled discrimination.
People have pasts, they make mistakes, they like things that aren't "normal". People regret things they may have done or didn't do. People also change; opinions change, interests change.
Mostly though, it isn't the world's responsibility to make you happy and if you think it is then you're going to be very disappointed in life.

("you" is a broad and general term not directed at any individual or group specifically.)

[nickjr]

on the whole i think the takeaway should be that those who like & enjoy DNI lists are valid, it's just not something that is well-suited for this site

like i think it should be viewed as a logistical thing first and foremost, and although mods have presented it that way i don't think a lot of people are viewing it like that

DNI lists on huge social media sites (you know the ones) that have automated modding, with lax rules and things that fly under the radar frequently and often: makes sense, not a strain on moderators because moderators are very rarely personally handling reports, and there are only a handful of rules to moderate by (no hate speech, no graphic content, again you know the ones) so DNI lists would almost never come up in a report

DNI lists on a small pet-collecting game with public forums, largely manual modding, with strict rules and few things that fly under the radar: logistical nightmare. real human mods have to go through every single report, and with all of the secondary rules that CS has (no personal info, no blacklists of specific users, etc.) both passive & active moderation of DNI lists to make sure that they ALL abide by CS's other rules, in addition to regularly tightening guidelines to find ways around loopholes that users will inevitably find (true for any rule that exists, people will always try to find work-arounds): it's not realistic or reasonable.

the workload for a mod on CS- who is obligated to moderate this site in accordance to the strict rules that make it the safe place we all know it as- is MUCH higher than the workload for a mod of a site that lets way more things fly.

a DNI list on a different website could allow way more on it than what could be mentioned on a DNI list on CS, which means that many people making or linking their lists on CS that they use for every other website = more reports and moderations to be dealt with.

CS mods are allowed to think of their time as valuable, just like everyone else's.

there are probably things that would make us all more comfortable on here (besides DNI lists) that are just simply not allowed because of the other rules; it's just a fact of using this website and that's okay!

I like what you said here. I think you put it pretty well.

While I do believe DNI lists are actively harmful and agree with the mods on that front, I don’t begrudge anyone for wishing to use them, and I agree with what someone else just mentioned about how there should be more kindness shown on both sides

But putting aside whether DNI lists are “good” or “bad,” they’re apparently just not working here on CS and the staff end up having to deal with the fallout. Since they’re not working… better to yeet them entirely so that the mods’ workload doesn’t continue to increase unnecessarily.

[Klaora]

This has been a delightfully fascinating topic and I'm DEFINITELY feeling my age here lol

I've never once felt the need to make a DNI (partly because I'm a freelancer and everyone's money spends the same, but also) because people are individuals and it's hard to make a judgement call based on 1-2 pieces of information.

Like, if someone came up to me and started talking to me about a piece of media that I don't particularly care for, I just tell them "Sorry, I'm not interested in that." Or you could block them. Either way, it's really not a big deal -and if it is for some reason, it's time for a walk.
And I DO have some mental illnesses that make certain things harder to handle and toxic people in my life that have ruined certain media for me. But I also know that most people on websites like Chicken Smoothie don't have ill intent by talking to me about such things.
For those that feel the need to have a DNI list, I've seen countless of suggestions on how to better cater your experience on Chicken Smoothie -from disabling signatures and more. These are WAY more effective than a passive list because while you can't control other people's actions, you can be proactive with yours.

The internet is not the end-all be-all of life. Every day, you talk to people around you in your community that don't think the same way that you do about things -the grocery store clerk, your postman, teachers, bosses, co-workers, classmates, etc. Like, you gonna call over the manager to get a different cashier because they're wearing a button with their Harry Potter house on it?

It's legit weird to not be able to send a trade to someone because maybe I like Spongebob and they don't. *shrug* I wasn't even going to mention Spongebob in my message, but now it's weird to even trade or tell you how much I like your Oekaki drawing.

I know that my thoughts aren't particularly organized here, but I guess what I'm getting at is that people are more than the sum of their parts and a little grace goes a long way.
Also, moderating DNI lists/potential harassment on a site like this is a logistical nightmare -signed a previous Pet site admin.

[Aaron✦]

This has been a delightfully fascinating topic and I'm DEFINITELY feeling my age here lol

I've never once felt the need to make a DNI (partly because I'm a freelancer and everyone's money spends the same, but also) because people are individuals and it's hard to make a judgement call based on 1-2 pieces of information.

Like, if someone came up to me and started talking to me about a piece of media that I don't particularly care for, I just tell them "Sorry, I'm not interested in that." Or you could block them. Either way, it's really not a big deal -and if it is for some reason, it's time for a walk.
And I DO have some mental illnesses that make certain things harder to handle and toxic people in my life that have ruined certain media for me. But I also know that most people on websites like Chicken Smoothie don't have ill intent by talking to me about such things.
For those that feel the need to have a DNI list, I've seen countless of suggestions on how to better cater your experience on Chicken Smoothie -from disabling signatures and more. These are WAY more effective than a passive list because while you can't control other people's actions, you can be proactive with yours.

The internet is not the end-all be-all of life. Every day, you talk to people around you in your community that don't think the same way that you do about things -the grocery store clerk, your postman, teachers, bosses, co-workers, classmates, etc. Like, you gonna call over the manager to get a different cashier because they're wearing a button with their Harry Potter house on it?

It's legit weird to not be able to send a trade to someone because maybe I like Spongebob and they don't. *shrug* I wasn't even going to mention Spongebob in my message, but now it's weird to even trade or tell you how much I like your Oekaki drawing.

I know that my thoughts aren't particularly organized here, but I guess what I'm getting at is that people are more than the sum of their parts and a little grace goes a long way.
Also, moderating DNI lists/potential harassment on a site like this is a logistical nightmare -signed a previous Pet site admin.

Agreed. Internet and real-life are different situations, but we still need to be able to interact with people who have different opinions than ours, and we can't judge people just for liking something we don't, even if a particular fandom has a bad reputation.

[removed]

And if you don't have trauma related to that topic, then it's actually a pretty good thing to discuss with people who think differently about something than you. Maybe they like a topic you don't like, and they have an interesting, nuanced reason for enjoying it. You don't have to change your mind, but you could have an insightful conversation! Maybe they love that piece of media for the set-design, and you can enjoy your own favorite media better for being aware of a new aspect of film-making.

This is making me feel pretty old too haha.

[Aaron✦]

I fully support this decision because DNI/BYF lists have always been absolutely useless in terms of protecting yourself. DNIs may give an illusion of safety, but the keyword here is illusion. They don't actually protect you. They don't actually make you any safer. They put you at higher risk. "Gross" people aren't going to refrain from interacting with someone just because they meet the criteria in a DNI list, in fact it's likely to make them MORE keen to interact because they'll know they're bothering you. Furthermore, these lists often detail extremely personal information like triggers, trauma, etc. and that's information you shouldn't be advertising to total strangers online. The less information you have about yourself online, the better protected you are.

In addition, as others have pointed out, DNI lists can often be targeting and exclusionary as well, which isn't a mentality to be fostering or encouraging. Someone can find one of their interests on a DNI list (an anime series or a favorite character that the user with the DNI personally doesn't like for whatever reason) and their feelings might be hurt because the person with the DNI is implying they're "gross" simply for having different tastes. As Poodlette said, it's petty, and it's judging a book by its cover by making assumptions about a person based on one facet of their interests. People are not one-dimensional beings, do not treat them as such.

[removed]

I'm going to reference the sentiments from the posts made by Pear and lugia492, as I feel they were good posts. The internet is not a safe space. It never was, and it's never going to be. You are never going to be able to completely eradicate things you don't like, whether online or offline. You're always going to run into people or topics that are going to test your comfort zones or fully make you uncomfortable. If you run into people or content you don't like, the block button is there for you to use.

And lastly, I agree with all of this:

the problem though is that a DNI list is like, the opposite of curating something urself. it's doing nothing and expecting the people in ur local vicinity to do that for you. like instead of someone blocking people they don't want to interact with they put up a list of things that could put them into an episode and are asking strangers to see that list & act accordingly

[Aaron✦]

CS is not a replacement for professional help where professional help is needed. We understand that that is not always easy or even possible, but plenty of resources have been supplied on this thread. I don't think we need any further discussion on this matter, so please try to keep posts relevant directly to the new rule.