Do You Ride Horses? V.4

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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Kestrell » Tue Jun 11, 2019 10:21 am

@ twisty
I find it's easier to practice canter in two-point at that stage. It helped me learn to have a steady leg below my center of balance. You could also try raising your stirrups ( I like mine around my ankle bone, a little shorter for jump work and longer for flat work). It could also be your muscles getting tight and not relaxing. You can try a couple of ankle rolls while walking to relax your legs.

@Luzien
The problem is I live in the middle of reaaaaaaally flat land. I don't have access to hills (or a hot walker for that matter). So I've been having to make due with arena work because it's just too darn wet to go into any of the fields or the local trails :/
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Blue_Aussie » Wed Jun 12, 2019 7:04 am

Ok, I've never posted in here but, I ride a sorrel gelding and I don't usually ride him but my favorite horse, Buddy, is too old for me to do speed avents and jumping with. That said, the new horse Dusty, does this weird bucking thing while cantering. I'm not sure if maybe he was a dressage horse at his last place? Any tips on how to fix it? I almost fell off a couple times lol
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Kestrell » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:06 pm

@Mapleshade

What do you mean by "bucking thing" ? Like crow hopping, or just arching his back?
It could mean quite a few things! First I would check saddle fit- it's one of those things you really have to keep on top of as horses change shape quite regularly, making their saddles fit better or worse at times. I'd also rule out pain. Does he flinch if his back is palpated? Then maybe have the vet out. You could also be asking for canter too aggressively and it's his way of showing how displeased he is.

You could also try lunging him and if his behavior changes that can also be an indicator!


ALSO, if he was a dressage horse, maybe he isn't used to western tack.... there's a huge difference between dressage (super round, "weight lifting" type riding and movement) and speed events (flat, "sprinting" type riding) and tack. I don't know your entire history or horse- but you can't just slap some western tack on an english trained horse and expect him to accept it with no hesitation.
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Blue_Aussie » Wed Jun 12, 2019 12:22 pm

Well, Dusty isn't my horse, I'm just training him so I don't know his background. He doesn't necessarily crow hop but kinda like that how he puts head down and does a little jump. And even when we are doing barrels and I don't ask for the canter, he still does it, he is a touchy horse but I don't think I put any leg pressure on him whatsoever.

I will ask more about his background and what he used to be used as, but the new owner says that as far as she knows he was only used as a trail horse, so I don't think the western tack is an issue... I'll learn more about crow hopping, though he doesn't do it that high. How do you fix or prevent crow hopping? Thank you for your help! I do have another question... How do you keep a horse from cantering sideways down the center of the arena? This is what makes me think he was a dressage horse because he only does it when we aren't on the rail...
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Kestrell » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:12 pm

@Mapleshade

If you're sure the hopping isn't caused by a medical issue, or a tack fitting issue then we can work with a behavioral issue. When my horse gets into a bucking fit 2 things need to happen. 1, I need to try my best to send him forward. A horse cannot continue to move at a forward pace AND concentrate on bucking. If you urge him forward and "ride him out of the buck" then he is less likely to continue to buck. 2, I need to keep his head up. A horse uses his head and neck as a counterweight of sorts... ie his balance will ALWAYS follow his neck and head. When a horse bucks, his head is lowered. So while he bucks, I need to do my best to raise his head and neck, throwing his balance out of where it wants to be (this is NOT aggressive pulling or "see-sawing", but is using the influence of the bit to bring his head up). Eventually riding through his fits with enough success (ie he will not escape work by bucking) he will learn it is not an effective evasion technique. Again, this is ONLY if we have ruled out a tack fitting, ill training, or pain related issue.

As for the running sideways issue... Dressage horses don't really do that.... One of my 3 disciplines is dressage and never once have any of my horses just taken off sideways down an arena lol. Without seeing a video of the actual event my best guess is that it's your fault or a muscle weakness for him. Horses move away from pressure and will always try to do what is easiest for them. If he has uneven muscling it can make pushing off of one leg much harder and thus make him want to lean a certain direction and thus end up going sideways down the arena. You could also be causing the issue. If your balance is off, the horse could simply be trying to "catch you"... but that's just my take on it. Try working on straightness with ground poles or even looking at some dressage moves. It's one of the best ways to build muscle and improve any horse!
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Blue_Aussie » Wed Jun 12, 2019 1:20 pm

Hmm, I am the only person that rides him right now so I'm not sure if it's my fault, I hope not because I'm not sure if or what I'm doing wrong... My friend has rode him when he just came and she got bucked (not really bucked but the thing he does)off while cantering also... She used a different saddle so maybe it's the bridle? I think he uses a jointed snaffle but I didn't pay much attention, I am going back to work with him this week and will pay attention to any thing he doesn't like, he does put his head up every time I try to put his bit in, maybe he has a dental issue. Sorry I'm kinda talking to myself while typing lol!
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Luzien » Thu Jun 13, 2019 3:43 am

Kestrell wrote:@ twisty
I find it's easier to practice canter in two-point at that stage. It helped me learn to have a steady leg below my center of balance. You could also try raising your stirrups ( I like mine around my ankle bone, a little shorter for jump work and longer for flat work). It could also be your muscles getting tight and not relaxing. You can try a couple of ankle rolls while walking to relax your legs.

@Luzien
The problem is I live in the middle of reaaaaaaally flat land. I don't have access to hills (or a hot walker for that matter). So I've been having to make due with arena work because it's just too darn wet to go into any of the fields or the local trails :/


hmm...not easy then...i only worked with hills or forest and trails there and between flat fields or meadows, or know of people who used hot walker for bad weather season, sorry :oops:

...maybe...build a trail in your arena to^^...do you got water where horses can get in and out without problem and walk around or even swim?
..or do you got a calm horse that you could use to ride while walking your horse in training? or a cart-gig-sulky whatever..? some train there horse at a bike to get them fit too...but there you need to trust your horse that it will stay close and calm in walk-trot and changing speed or direction.
(endurance horse trainer (also some who are good to there horse in nrmal racing) often have the best training programs how to train in endurance and condition horses in humid or rainy or wet areas^^)

- https://perseveranceendurancehorses.wor ... -training/
Quote from them: Phase one: I am referring to impatience. Few people will find the Walking Phase easy, but it is a good lesson in self-control and therefore worth more than gold to the endurance rider. Remember, the method only works if it is correctly applied. Do not skip Phase one.

EXPLANATION OF TERMS
1.Conditioning: Working the horse to become strong enough to complete endurance rides without damage.
2.Hard work/ workout: This involves hard work where you ask the horse to put in a greater effort than he is accustomed to. Typically, 20 minutes after the workout the horse’s pulse will be higher than you are used to. That means you have stressed it.
3.Recovery day: On these days you allow the horse to recover from the stress. Exercises you can do are twenty minute lunge sessions (ring work) at a steady trot, schooling, a gentle hack or outride, etc.
4.Rest day: Typically a Sunday. No work at all.
5.Exercise: The level of work that does not stress the horse. It just maintains the fitness.

TIME SCALES:
The beginning of a Long Slow Distance ride
The time it takes for various body tissues to adapt and condition, are as follows:
1.Heart and lungs 3 months
2.Muscles 3-6 months
3.Tendons and ligaments 6-12 months
4.Hooves 7 months
5.Bone 1-3 years
NB! A horse can be got fit enough to go fast in a relatively short period, but will not be conditioned to withstand injury. Only after 3 seasons of endurance (provided he had no serious tendon/ligament injuries) will he be thoroughly conditioned to be ridden hard and competitively.
“IF THERE ARE SHORTCUTS, NO ONE HAS DISCOVERED THEM YET"

PROGRAM

Begin with LSD (Long Slow Distance)
The goal is to build a broad foundation of stamina by riding long distances slowly. The different phases define the type of workouts that will be used. We recommend that through all the phases you lunge the horse at trot one day a week and school one day a week. Workouts are done on outrides.

BAREFOOT HORSES
We used this program for many years before we switched to barefoot riding. It is suitable for shod horses. If you plan to keep your horse barefoot, you need to extend the period of the Phases to give the hooves more time to adapt. The hooves can be worn quite short and need time to grow. By increasing the distances ridden slowly over a longer time, the hoof gets more chance to adjust and recover.

-PHASE 1 (WALKING) lasts 6 weeks (Barefoot horses 3 months)

Goal: To prepare the horse physically and psychologically for more intensive exercise. To start the conditioning of the legs and tendons. To build muscle. To make the horse calm and obedient. To accustom the horse to the open road. To teach the rider discipline!

4 or 5 workouts per week. Build up to 2-3 hours of active walk per session. The horse must walk with purpose and not lag. The horse must learn to walk properly and not jog. He must learn to walk on a loose rein with his head down and neck extended so that his back can swing freely to develop the back muscles. Use varied terrain – rough, stony veld, ridges or mountains, sand, even tar road for limited distances. During the work sessions only walk – the horse can trot in the lunge ring, and trot and canter during schooling. But during the work sessions the horse may only walk, even up hills, just walk.

By walking uphill the horse builds strong muscle. After a few weeks you will see what I mean. (Tip: At the start of Phase 1, take a photo of the horse’s quarters from behind, pull the tail out of the way so you can see the inner thigh muscles too. After 6 weeks take another picture. Compare the muscling.)

In between, one day lunging, one day school.

- Rest day optional. Because walking is low intensity work, a rest day is not essential, but it will certainly do no harm to have a day off. (best with other horses in pasture-paddock)

If you don’t have enough time to ride that often, you can aim at riding a total of 48 hours of walking. The 48 hours is derived from 4 workouts x 2 hours x 6 weeks. In practise it will lengthen the period of the Walking Phase, but you will have the peace of mind that the horse has walked the requisite kilometres and time.

In the last 2 weeks of Phase 1 you can begin trotting short distances during the walking sessions in preparation for Phase 2.

PHASE 2 (Trotting) lasts 4 to 6 weeks. (Barefoot horses 3 months)
Goal: to develop the horse’s stamina so that it can trot long distances rhthymically and at a constant pace. To develop the trotting muscles and teach the horse an energy-saving trot. To teach the horse not to just canter, but to stay in trot until asked to canter. To make the rider’s legs strong enough to ride long distances at the trot. To teach the rider self control. To prepare the horse physically for more intensive exercise.

Trotting: Abbi Tennant & PSV Liberty, Ashley Gower & PSV Mercury

3 or 4 workouts per week. Start out at the walk until the horse is thoroughly warmed up (15-20 minutes). Begin trotting slowly and alternate with periods of walking if the horse becomes tired or out of breath. Build up gradually until the horse can trot actively for 2 hours without a break. The younger or less experienced the horse is, the more gradual should be the increase in pace during the phase. The horse must learn to trot relaxed with head low, neck extended and back rounded. Only this way can he develop long powerful strides.

The powerful, ground-eating hundred miler trot takes years to perfect. Don’t push the horse into a faster trot. It will too easily throw him off balance and onto the forehand. A horse like that will hang on the reins, is hard to stop and turn and puts strain on his forelegs. (Does that sound familiar?) Rather keep him back a little and let him find his correct balance. As the horse becomes fitter, he will start pushing himself. Keep him in a rhythmic trot. (Count in your head: a thousand and one, a thousand and two, a thousand and three, … to find the rhythm.) Don’t let the horse fall into a canter. Horses that are allowed to canter when they want, will not develop their trotting muscles. The horse can canter in the school. Use different routes. Hills will be more intensive work than flat ground so give him a rest after that.

If time is limited, some of the trotting workouts can be replaced by a workout on the lunge. Up to 40 minutes maximum (5 minutes of warm up at the walk not included) of trotting in the ring at a rhythmic pace. 40 minutes lunging will replace 2 hours of trotting on the road. Ring work is harder work than the road because the horse has to keep his body bent laterally and that takes more energy. You can’t replace all roadwork with lunging because the horse has to be used to the rider’s weight and learn to balance himself at the trot.

In between, 2 recovery days: 1 day lunging, 1 day school.

A rest day is essential. At least one rest day per week. If the horse does not feel right, or begins his workout with low energy, give him a few days off. He might be sick or overtrained (not adjusted to the work he is doing).

NB: Horses differ greatly in their work ability. If the work load is too heavy for your horse, you can put in fewer workouts per week. Give those horses a longer time to condition before you go to an endurance ride.

PHASE 3 (Canter) lasts 2 weeks or longer (Barefoot horses 4 weeks or longer)
Cantering: Francois Seegers & PSV Platinum
Goal: To make the horse’s heart and lungs fit. To teach the horse to canter rhythmically and a constant speed. To enjoy life.

2 sessions per week (or 5 sessions in 14 days). Warm up first. Start trotting and canter short distances. Alternate the canter with trotting to clear lactic acid from the muscles. Build up gradually until the horse can canter for a total of 1 hour per session interspersed with trot for a total of 2 hours. Longer rides can be attempted too. Teach the horse to ride at a controlled canter with other horses. Teach him to canter relaxed on a long rein at a constant speed (not easy with a hot horse). In the first season do not sprint the horse at full speed.

In between, 2 to 4 recovery days: 1 day lunging, 1 day school.

Rest days are absolutely essential. One to three rest days per week. If the horse does not feel right or starts his workout without energy, give him a few extra days off.

PHASE 4 (Building reserves/Tapering) lasts 1 week.

Building Reserves
One week before the endurance ride, let the horse recover with light work only. Remember to reduce his energy concentrates accordingly.

In short: It should take you 3 to 4 months (7 months for a barefoot horse) to prepare for your first slow 80 km. You can enter for a 30 or 60 km before you attempt the first 80 km to get more experience or to make the horse used to long distances more gradually. With a novice horse you can take a leisurely 5 to 6 hours to complete the 80 km, depending on the terrain. For the novice rider it is a great achievement to complete 80 km. For the experienced rider on a novice horse it is a brick in the foundation of the horse’s career. Only in a horse’s third season of endurance can one really see what the horse is capable of, in terms of speed over distance.

PRINCIPLES
1.Build the horse up gradually to maximum work.
2.A stressful session must be followed by a day of recovery.
3.As you train faster and harder, you need to put in more recovery days. While you are just walking, no days for recovery are necessary, but you need to lunge and school to develop the horse properly.
4.Remember the principle of improvement is based on stress and recovery to a higher plane of fitness. If no recovery is allowed, you will break down what you have built up by causing injuries to the weakest parts.
5.No more than 2 of the hardest workouts per week.
6.1 complete rest day per week.
7.Don’t do hard workouts on consecutive days. (That is only for advanced horses, not novices)
8.Lunge one day a week (ring work) Slow rhythmic trot for +/- 20 minutes. Done right, it will improve obedience, suppleness and power. We seldom canter young horses in the ring because of the risk of injuries like overreach or slipping or ligament injuries.
9.One day a week school your horse to make him supple and obedient.

Keep Records

Keep track of your horse’s exercise. Monitor the fitness and improvement of the horse over time. You must be able to take your horse’s pulse. Use your hand just behind the horse’s left elbow, or a stethoscope or a heart rate monitor. Before the workout take your horse’s resting pulse. Most horses will be between 28 and 48 beats per minute at rest. Know your horse’s typical resting pulse, eg 40. As the horse becomes fitter, the resting pulse will drop, eg to 38 or 36. Unusually high resting pulses like 66 indicate excitement or fear, or they can be signs of pain or fever as with colic or biliary fever.

After exercise take the pulse again, eg, 5 or 10 minutes after stopping exercise, to see how quickly the pulse drops. The fitter the horse, the quicker it drops. You can also measure it 20 minutes to get an idea what it would be at maximum time you have at the vet check. Speed of exercise, degree of fatigue, and weather conditions will influence recovery pulses.

It’s best to fill in a book after every workout or exercise with a description of the time and type of work, pulse measurements before and after exercise and any remarks. It can give you a very good record of your horse’s progress.


- http://www.olddominionrides.org/EndurancePrimer/01.html

- https://veteriankey.com/training-endurance-horses/
--> initial training of an Endurance horse should be based on long, slow distance work.
Initial walking sessions may be over 5 to 10 km (3–6 miles), three to four times a week, with a few short periods of trotting for several minutes during the session. After 3 to 4 weeks, once the horse has recovered well following an hour or two of continuous exercise, longer rides can be introduced, with 2 to 3 hours of mostly walking and some trotting, perhaps at a pace averaging around 10 kilometers per hour (kph; 6 miles per hour [mph]), for up to 20 km (12 miles) total distance, followed by a rest day. The horse can be walked then trotted in 5-minute blocks and as fitness increases, the blocks of time can be slowly increased. For instance, the time spent trotting should be doubled, and a similar amount of time should be spent walking or until the horse has recovered from the faster pace, which would be evidenced by the return of heart rate (HR) and respiratory rate (RR) to normal. Such workouts can be performed three to four times per week in the initial stages. Most of this work is best done on flat ground, progressing to some hill work, again depending how the horse is responding to the training. Some horses may prefer cantering to trotting, in which case cantering can be substituted for trotting. At this stage of endurance training, the aim should not be competitiveness, but rather, ensuring that the horse is not overworked and has training sessions that are interesting and are not likely to induce lameness. Trotting the horse “in hand” after each training session is good practice for veterinary inspections and very useful for detecting any problems early.

As the horse’s fitness increases and it is able to go further and faster, additional longer sessions can be added per week. The longer sessions can be gradually increased by 5 km (3 miles) each week, progressing up to a total distance of 40 km (25 miles), using walking, trotting and some cantering. As always, the response of the horse to this increase should be monitored closely, to ensure adequate recovery before each session.

According to most endurance race rules, training rides at affiliated events are restricted with regard to the speed the horses can travel, based on the realization that going too fast too early in a horse’s career can cause damage. Training rides are generally 40 km (25 miles) and the horse should be able to cover that distance in 3 to 4 hours. Having a measured training track and progressively increasing the distance travelled in training allow the rider to monitor the progress of the horse, by checking the distance, time travelled, and most importantly, the horse’s response to the exercise. The most useful measure of fitness is HR—at rest, the maximum during exercise, and the recovery after exercise.


- http://www.endurancegbcheshire.co.uk/tr ... rance.html

- https://ker.com/equinews/training-horse ... endurance/ (kentucky equine research -Training Horses for Speed or Endurance)

- https://articles.extension.org/pages/11 ... ne-athlete
-> Slow-speed long distance conditioning, or endurance Training, High-speed conditioning ,Interval training is the use of multiple workouts on the same day separated by short rest periods, Skill Horse Training(Training what your horse is used for) --free day for horse

- http://globalendurance.com/ (maybe ...they tell they help with making training programm )
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Kestrell » Thu Jun 13, 2019 9:07 am

@Luzien

I'm DROOLING over those resources rn- I didn't even think of endurance riding as a resource omg! Thank you so much
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby paleosuchus » Mon Jun 17, 2019 12:05 pm

Alright I started riding lessons and I'm hooked now.
The health scare i had turned out to be really minor so I've been cleared to do whatever I want exercise wise, including riding.
Because I work at the stable and my boss likes me she lets me ride for free all the time, I only pay for two lessons a week. I'm about to start leasing one of the horses and I'm so in love. I feel so connected to her. I've talked to my boss and as I get the money for it I'll be able to start setting up my own corner of the tack room (theres a tack room for leasers/boarders called the tack room and another for school tack usually called the school room). Just went online and bought a brush set to use on the horse, as well as heart shaped apple treats. All the brushes are purple so I think next I'll buy a purple saddle pad, and eventually my own saddle. (Suggestions for the saddles? I do english dressage. I've been told wintec is the best brand for beginners but holy cow they are expensive).
Yeah I'm really excited I know I sound like a noob right now :lol:
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Re: Do You Ride Horses? V.4

Postby Hime » Mon Jun 17, 2019 7:27 pm

honeybears wrote:Alright I started riding lessons and I'm hooked now.
The health scare i had turned out to be really minor so I've been cleared to do whatever I want exercise wise, including riding.
Because I work at the stable and my boss likes me she lets me ride for free all the time, I only pay for two lessons a week. I'm about to start leasing one of the horses and I'm so in love. I feel so connected to her. I've talked to my boss and as I get the money for it I'll be able to start setting up my own corner of the tack room (theres a tack room for leasers/boarders called the tack room and another for school tack usually called the school room). Just went online and bought a brush set to use on the horse, as well as heart shaped apple treats. All the brushes are purple so I think next I'll buy a purple saddle pad, and eventually my own saddle. (Suggestions for the saddles? I do english dressage. I've been told wintec is the best brand for beginners but holy cow they are expensive).
Yeah I'm really excited I know I sound like a noob right now :lol:

I would suggest not buying your own saddle. And Wintecs are actually very cheap in terms of saddles, if comparing prices of brand new saddles in general. ^^; The thing with saddles is that priority number 1 is that the saddle fits the horse it's used for, and NO saddle in the world is one-fits-all kind. Unfitting saddle can cause all sorts of problems for the horse, and even if only used couple times a week certain horses are very sensitive to ill fitting saddes and will not move correctly with one. So really buying a saddle is not really so much about picking one you like and can afford, but more so what is good fit for the horse with riders needs coming second.
Only scenarios where I would say it's wise to buy your own saddle is if you own a horse (obviously) or if you regularily ride one certain horse and that horse's saddle is not right for you to the point where you have hard time riding (like the saddle puts your in chair seat or is too big/small for you).
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