Cat Chat (please go to cat chat 2)

[The Lost soul]

Yep. the power of the elder cat! Beware the elder glare!!

Older cats have this glare they give. It is such a wisdom-filled glare that can express such strong emotion in a single look.

Glad we could help. have a nice day Koolkat!

[koolkatkoolkat123]

well we let him out for 10 minutes today, he was not impressed because when we let the kitten out apparantly he must go out too. We don't want him to get lost or wander too far and my older kitty Chippy keeps an eye on him problem is he looks quite hateful though that might be because it was pouring down

[The Lost soul]

Older cats look at youngsters as a nuisance most of the time, but they also know not to kill the bugger in his sleep.

I hope Chippy warms up to the kitten.

[koolkatkoolkat123]

I think he already has, sort of, Frank the kitten licks his ears a lot and Chippy just lets him. My little sister has a really long video of Frank just licking his ears though in the middle he does try and tell him no but he keeps doing it and they do play a lot i hear scrabbling downstairs and then screeching (Which is Chippy) followed by actual miaows (never had a cat that miaows normally, thats Frank) at night

[.galaxy.]

I was just wondering if I could get advice on my two cats(The mother and one of her male kittens we kept)?

Sugar(The mother, approximately 2 1/2 years old-She's a street rescue, no idea of her real age) used to be this adorably sweet cat, she'd never leave me alone, always laying in the crook of my neck and purring for hours on end. I took it she was just grateful- she was abused as a kitten, when I found her she was frightened and covered in cigarette burns. While we had her, we had two male cats, Max and Jim. Jim was a very old tom, he was fixed. Max was not, and he was very territorial. He eventually got Sugar pregnant, and she had her first litter of kittens. No problems there at all, three gorgeous kittens. They grew up and went to homes(of friends) and grew up, no hitches. And Sugar went back to being the purring, loving cat she was, instead of the stern mother she'd become. And all was well.

Until we moved to our new house, a neighborhood with many male cats around. It was a given that she got pregnant again. She had them outside(My mom made it so) in a warm little hut-like box I'd made her. Four little kittens. I even named them all. Maya, Kumi, Nefarious, and Sparky. Kumi and Maya went to the same home, and we kept Sparky and Nefarious. Sparky was a bi-color tabby, Nefarious was a mini-me of his mum((Adorable black and white)). Sparky went missing after about two weeks, and now we just have Sugar and Nefarious. During the time when Sugar had all four kittens, she became distant and aggressive, even towards her kittens at times. The sweet, loving cat I knew disappeared under the stern motherly figure once again.

That was a few months ago. Nefarious is now about 8 months old, and very playful. A little to playful at times. He can get rough in his playing, and I've tried ignoring him and tapping him on the nose. And Sugar has become even more aggressive towards him. I haven't heard her purr in weeks, only very short moments when Nefarious isn't around. When I attempt to hold her, she gives me this strange stare and runs back to the spot at the end of my bed where she sleeps. When Nefarious even approaches her, she makes that odd Rrrrrrrrrrrr sound((Sorry, I forgot the correct term for it Dx)) and swats him around. He runs under my bed or over to me, and I can't resist coddling him.

All in all, Sugar is nothing like she used to be. I'm afraid that it might have something to do with Nefarious being present. I want my sweet ball of fur who would cuddle and purr for hours. And Nefarious has grown more rough with his playing. He'll run around my room for God knows how long, knocking things over and swatting at anything that moves. Sometimes when he's laying at my side, I'll try to pet him, and he'll purr. But it doesn't last long. He'll roll over and grab my hand and start biting and scratching. I can tell he's playing because of his demeanor, there's no aggression in his eyes. But I'll often come out with several scratches. I've tried doing the recommended things to try and avoid him being aggressive in the future, but it doesn't work to well.

And lately he's been growing more and more... I believe the word arrogant or cocky would fit his newfound description. He's going after our dogs now, our old Border Collie, and our Pitbull mix. Both large dogs. Last night I was woken up with Nefarious cornered under my dresser by our Border Collie Max. There was blood on Nefarious' paw, not sure if he got Max, or Max got him. And this is very strange behavior. Normally the animals give each other a wide berth, and Nefarious used to be sweet and innocent, terrified of the dogs. He and his brother would try to chase them, and run away mortified when they got a reaction.

I just want to know how to calm them down, my cats, I mean. I want Sugar to relax and become the sweet-heart she used to be, not this stern, grumpy cat she is now. And I want Nefarious to stop being so aggressive, I'm scared that he'll get hurt. I held him crying after I woke up to him being cornered. I was terrified that he might have gotten hurt more. So please, any and all help is greatly appreciated.

[porchlights]

I had two kitties named Sylvester and Winchester. They were feral brothers that didn't look much alike. Their mother wandered into an old folk's home up in a real desert-ey area past the Los Angeles forest.
They stayed with me for three years, but I recently had to part with them when I moved across the country - we were driving the whole way for days on end and cats generally don't do well with travel. Both of them found good homes with people, but I miss them a whole lot.

[Saracirce]

@Nepeta: You need to tire out Nefarious. He sounds like a typical, high energy kitten. Play with him for about 15 minutes but don't let him catch the toy until the end. Then feed right after. He's natural response should be to groom himself after he eats then go to sleep. You can also try walking him on a harness to help.

For Sugar, my only suggestion is to stay calm and quiet around her and let her come to you. Don't force anything. When she does come to you, give her a super tasty treat and talk softly to her. There's this stuff for sell that's like aroma therapy and is pheromones. I can't remember the name off the top of my head but it should help calm her.

I would separate the cats because it sounds like Sugar is stressed out and needing space. Get them both fixed and then start reintroducing them slowly as if they were complete strangers.

For the dogs, you'll need someone to help you with this one. Start with them on opposite sides of a large room with dogs at one end, Nefarious on the other (you may need the dogs on a leash or in their crate and Nefarious in a carrier). Feed super tasty treats to all of them for just being in the same room and being calm. Don't feed if they're overly focused on each other. They should be focused on you. You can SLOWLY (I stress the word slowly) work towards getting them closer and being calm. If needed, you may even have to start in separate rooms but still being able to see each other. The goal is to keep them under their threshold, which means not to the point of reacting. When you're not working with them, they should never be in the same room as each other, especially if unsupervised. I know this'll be hard and time consuming but it's worth it.

In the end though, none of this may work and you should consider the possibility of having to rehome Nefarious.

[The Lost soul]

Rehome Nefarious... yikes.
I dislike the idea, but Sar has got a pretty good idea going.... Nefarious, man, that kitten.
Sounds like more info is needed on how Nefarious acts but Sar's got what I think will help going for them.

If it doesn't help, maybe you need more detailed, complicated training.... but that takes up precious time, and can be explained only if Sar's idea doesn't work. I don't want to pile on more to your plate right now... sounds like Sugar needs some lovin sugar, and Nefarious needs some serious boundaries.


Poor scrap... something has got him itching for a fight.

[Saracirce]

No one likes the idea of rehoming an animal but if it comes down to one or more animal's mental and physical health being on the line and nothing else is working, it's the best thing to do. It's definitely hard and tends to be heartbreaking but it's better then an animal being permanently injured or worse. We had to rehome Boo's sister because of her level of aggression and bullying. It wasn't something I wanted to do in the least but it was in both of their best interests and Boo at least is better off for it.

And I prefer being called Sara.

[.galaxy.]

It's just very stressful lately. It's so sudden to. Nefarious used to be quite docile and sweet, then he suddenly became... Rough? Before just about a week ago, the animals wanted nothing to do with each other, and now Sugar seems very uncomfortable, and the dogs and Nefarious have had several aggressive clashes. I think it might be due to the fact that Sugar might be nearing heat, but I'm not sure.

Playing with him usually works. I'd play with him for about 20 minutes, then he'd go drink water and eat his food, then he'd come back up onto the bed or go under my bed and sleep until the next morning. But his energy levels have escalated drastically over the last week. I thought it quite funny in the beginning, now the glamour of him running around, being a cute little kitten is rubbing off. I'm thinking of just letting him loose in a room filled with toys, and leave him to his own devices for a while.

As for Sugar, I've been doing that. To be honest, it's working, more or less. She has no trouble coming up to me and cuddling like she used to, but as soon as Nefarious is brought into the equation, she becomes hostile. It is probably due to the fact that as a kitten, and just up until not long ago, he pestered her none stop, until she put him in line.