*URGENT* HELP STOP BC WOLF MANAGEMENT PLAN!

[rassiekins]

I'm all for saving wildlife and protecting wolves from barbaric things such as inhumane hunting practices and slow torture and death. I spent a good chunk of my life obsessed with the creatures and they were the first thing I was ever fascinated with as a child (and I read every book in my schools library on them by the time I was in third grade). However, I'm also a realist. They aren't proposing killing and managing the wolves just because they want to, but because the wolves are causing problems. Sure, some of the problems are with humans and they are selfish human reasons people want to manage the wolves, but they aren't ALL about silly human wants. The fact of the matter is, if there are too many wolves, and too little food supply, there is a problem. If the wolves breed and grow large packs and kill off all the elk, it's not just a problem for the humans who want to hunt and eat the elk. It's a problem for the wolves (and any other predators in the area that benefit from the elk) as well. If unchecked, the wolves will kill all of the elk out of a need to survive (unlike humans who have done such things just from sport) and then when they've killed all the wild elk they will move onto domesticated animals on ranches. Then they will grow hungry, and start to starve, and some will die horrible painful deaths (much much worse than being shot and bleeding out) and others will move on to other sources of food, from wild to domesticated animals, to pets, possibly even to humans. And then there will be no choice but to kill them left and right, and try to trap them to move them somewhere else.

The fact is that bad things happen when there are too many predators in an area for how much prey there is. Nature keeps the balance generally by having more prey in one area than predators. However, sometimes that doesn't happen, and more often than not it's because HUMANS got in the way. We moved one kind of animal to a new place they weren't in before, and let them be wild and breed and kill off all the prey that were not prepared to deal with them because they never have before. Or we go out of our way to protect them from things that would have killed them "naturally" (like it or not, a wolf going onto a ranch and being shot and killed by the rancher is a "natural" death, since humans are a part of nature and just like any other animals must protect their own things). If nature had managed itself there wouldn't be that many wolves in the area, and there wouldn't be a problem. But humans have stepped in in various ways and made it a problem. Now humans need to clean up after themselves.

All that being said, I don't fully understand the situation in the area, why there are so many wolves in the area that now need to be managed, or what measures have been tried before. I don't know and understand the management plan, and I'm sure a lot of it I would probably disagree with (such as gunning ANYTHING down from a helicopter, or using a machine gun, or not requiring permits and restrictions on hunting). I'm sure it needs work and needs to be more humane than it is, but in some cases, humans have to protect the wolves from themselves, even if it means killing, trapping or sterilizing them. My point is that we can't be romantic in these kind of situations and run around talking only of how amazing wolves are, or how majestic, or how smart or beautiful or helpless (as I see many people do these days). We have to look at the long term, and decide what needs to be done to best help them in the long run. If that means killing some now so that the breed will continue on and they can continue to be amazing as a species in the future, then we need to be smart enough to accept that and do what we must for the whole of the species, not just those alive now.

Other animals don't think like we do. If they see their family die they may grieve for a short period but they they won't stress or be depressed due to it for long.

Many of my cats/gerbils have died do to their companion dying. They were perfectly healthy, but once their buddy was gone they died within a month or so.

Domesticated animals are very different from wild animals when it comes to losing a companion or loved one. Domesticated animals (such as cats, gerbils, and dogs) have a different kind of bond with each other, one that is much more human in a way, and they do not live their lives knowing they may die every day. A wild animals learns very early on that their companions and family die. They learn that everyone dies. Animals do mourn for their fallen companions in the wild, but that mourning is never as long as a domesticated animals, nor is it ever as severe, because it's something they have been prepared for. A death of a companion is a drastic change for a pet and it changes everything about the life they've lived, but for a wild animal it's just another thing to move through and live through. Cats and dogs can grow distraught, even die of grief or go mad if they lose a baby, but a wolf would simply move on, care for the other babies or simply try to have more later.

That's not saying we shouldn't care, because wild animals do feel pain and grief and love, just that it's a different kind in comparison to ours and our pets.

[Grimace]

First of all, I would highly advise not taking anything from a website called "howls for justice ; barbaric wolf slaughter" as factual information, without doing your own research from an unbiased source.

"· Machine gunning of wolves where caribou herds are in severe decline

· Continued sterilization of wolves when a decade of this has not increased caribou numbers"

You guys do realize these two things are beneficial to the wolves themselves, right?
If the law is actually put in place to allow completely unregulated hunting, thats dumb, but i highly doubt thats what is going on.

they are not endangered * grey wolves* so i say they should go for it

So if I think there's too many people I should do the same since we aren't endangered?

Also, speaking purely from the standpoint of what would be best for life on earth in general, a massive cull of humans would be incredibly beneficial. So yes, it would be, but it won't ever happen because ethics and all that.

[ghastlymirror]

i have been facepalming at some of the first posts.
Like the last two people who posted, i have no problem with hunting as a tool for management, as long as proper legislation is used and humane methods are used. And we have to take in the fact that A: Grey wolves are no longer endangered. B: they are so numerous that its cause decrease in the elk population.

Here is a simple ecology fact, the more predadors a area has, this means that more prey gets eaten, too many predators= less prey. less prey=less predators. And we have to consider that there are other predator species in the same area as wolves, what about them?

Now, i dont know much about this BC management plan to judge wheter or not it is being ethical, but i think you should look for more information about it thant just in the howling for justice blog, because it might not be correct.

[arcticwolf]

i have been facepalming at some of the first posts.
Like the last two people who posted, i have no problem with hunting as a tool for management, as long as proper legislation is used and humane methods are used. And we have to take in the fact that A: Grey wolves are no longer endangered. B: they are so numerous that its cause decrease in the elk population.

Here is a simple ecology fact, the more predadors a area has, this means that more prey gets eaten, too many predators= less prey. less prey=less predators. And we have to consider that there are other predator species in the same area as wolves, what about them?

Now, i dont know much about this BC management plan to judge wheter or not it is being ethical, but i think you should look for more information about it thant just in the howling for justice blog, because it might not be correct.

I agree.
"baww save teh wolfzz!11"
Sorry, but no. I'm all for this, so no, I won't help you "stop" it.

[Saracirce]

Just because the wolves may be killed all year round doesn't mean that it won't be regulated. I highly disagree with poaching and unregulated hunting but regulated hunting is a good thing. It helps all the wildlife. The fact is, humans have already messed up the ecosystem so much, most habitats can't regulate themselves. So we have to help it.

Personally, I live in a state where our University's mascot, the Black Bear, is hunted once a year. It's highly contested by some people. But you know what? Not only does it help the moose, deer and humans, but it helps the bears themselves. There are less problematic bears intruding on human towns and having to be killed because of it because the population is being regulated. I am all for the continuation of the bear hunting.

[Topiratti]

http://howlingforjustice.wordpress.com/2012/12/04/action-alert-december-5th-last-day-to-comment-on-barbaric-bc-wolf-management-plan/

Please please please send an email to the people specified in this site! The deadline is today, and if this goes through the wolves of British Columbia will be open to trapping, baiting, sterilization, machine gunning, and year-round killing in some regions! It only takes a couple minutes to write a letter, and each voice is needed greatly! Talking points are listed on the site. PLEASE HELP!

Sometimes people need to intervine with wildlife rather then allowing it to manage on their own.

Its not like they are endangered and are facing extinction, humane control regarding population is better then seeing wolves starve to death because theres a lack of food.

I wonder if i should start a petition to allow Alberta to lift the Pet Rat ban <.<, or Maybe Ontario and their Pitbull ban?

Not like i live in Alberta, but hey, at least BC isnt making them illegal and shooting every one of them in site.

[WinterSkyWolf]

Everyone goes on about how wolves need to be managed in order to save elk populations and keep the balance of nature and everything, but I think HUMANS are the real ones who have to be managed. Humans are way too overpopulated, and the most destructive species on Earth. Humans could eliminate every other species of animal if they really wanted to.

Yet nobody kills off other humans to manage our own population. Why? Because it's cruel, unethical, and unacceptable. People couldn't imagine killing another human for the good of the population as a whole, because they think it's wrong. Why kill a wolf if you wouldn't kill a human? We are both intelligent beings aware of the world around us, with emotions and feelings. We both have families and mates. We really aren't that different. Humans should start treating ALL other animals as equals instead of inferiors.

I can understand why humans want to manage wildlife, but personally I think it should all be left alone. Let it go with the flow. If all the elk will die, let it happen. If the wolves will overpopulate, let it happen. Let them sort themselves out and stop trying to control life.

[Lupen]

Humans actually haven't reached their carrying capacity yet, so technically we aren't overpopulated, but yeah, population control would be beneficial to us. But you're right, we're not going to go around murdering people. Not because it'd be painful and cruel in the way you're thinking, it's because people actually DO have more complex emotions and we do mourn and feel differently than wolves, for example. But if we did go around killing humans, you wouldn't mind being the first to go, would you?

I would be all for human population control though if it were another method.

Also, letting the wolves overpopulate to incredible proportions will affect us, too, and as I already said, it's more beneficial than harmful to wolves themselves. They'll enroach into towns, and due to starvation they'll get even more desperate. They'll kill rancher's cattle more than they already do. They'll kill our pets. They'll be a danger to children especially. I don't think people realize that. WE are part of nature too.

[Onew~]

Other animals don't think like we do. If they see their family die they may grieve for a short period but they won't stress or be depressed due to it for long. Being shot at by hunters isn't stressful either. It's an instant death which is far more humane than the way the majority of us get our meat.

Wildlife can manage itself, but through starvation and disease. I'm more for animal welfare personally, so I'd rather them die a less painful and much more quick death. But if you'd rather them die slowly, alright.

How do you know if animals don't grieve like we do? You can't read their minds. Being shot IS stressful, if it's in the body and not an instant death. Look up wolf hunting youtube, you can clearly see they're in pain. Wildlife has been managing itself long before humans were here.

Research. Wolves aren't as smart as us, they don't have as complex feelings, brains, etc. They can't have thoughts like we do just like they can't talk in a language as complex as ours. I believe many animals with social structures can grieve, but they're not going to fuss about it all of their life. They get over it.

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And if you -- if ANYONE on here wants to bring up the "Well we should control human population, we're the most overpopulated!!111", you better be willing to die, to sacrifice all of your friends and family. You aren't? Didn't think so, buddy.

[WinterSkyWolf]

And if you -- if ANYONE on here wants to bring up the "Well we should control human population, we're the most overpopulated!!111", you better be willing to die, to sacrifice all of your friends and family. You aren't? Didn't think so, buddy.

I actually would sacrifice myself if it was for the better of everyone else. That's just the type of person I am. Of course I wouldn't want to, but if it had to be done I'm positive that I would. I wouldn't sacrifice my friends and family though, unless they wanted to themselves...