*DISCONTINUED* Rares List Guide (1 March 2019)

[Animall]

By saying we need to allow the community to be heard by running a poll, you are essentially claiming that the discussion within this thread is not open up to the community. It is though. Everyone agrees with moving the gap and there is NO reason to keep it where it is, so why bother polling? It’s a huge waste of time especially since we haven’t even begun polling for the ur foal. I’m getting extremely impatient waiting for it, personally. There is no need to poll on everything, especially if everyone has already agreed through discussion to move it. Who would even be against moving the gap and making the list more accurate?

I agree with elementalinsanity. Such a big waste of time. Can we just edit the thread and get onto the foal already? We have a huge list of discussions to get through and we need to stop getting distracted.

[DaDwarf]

The thread isn't as open as you think it is. People are still scared to post, because if they disagree with something they get called out on it. Just post you agree and you are fine, but as soon as you aren't in the majority, well... I'm not saying the thread isn't the community, i'm saying the rest of the community, those who don't, can't or won't post here, should get a shot too.


We need to move on with the poll for the foal, that is true. So then, add (re)moving the big gap and changing the list to alphabetical order to the next in line note and move on. This thread is great at going in circles, but deciding something big just on the thread isn't something we should do anymore. we moved on from that.

[ElementalInsanity]

I wasn’t meaning to be jumping on you in the slightest, I was expressing how everyone in the past four pages of discussion and even some new faces posted they agreed with both suggestions.
Just like you give your opinion I was giving mine. ^^

I don’t feel that if new pets are added they’ll need some special coding from being new and in alphabetical order. If people don’t read the first post of additions why would they go through the entire list to see what was added?

As Animall said those who discuss here are community. They are voices and I still don’t see a need to poll every decision like this. Especially when nearly everyone posting has been for these two suggestions, something that’s a bit rare itself.
Because of so many people agreeing for it I feel it’s something we should do now.

Also I totally get if it becomes a bit of a hassle to edit. If anything I suppose you could turn that over to another user who could be on top of editing easier and not on mobile? I know myself I’m mobile bound and it’s a pain to edit.

[Targaryen]

I wasn’t meaning to be jumping on you in the slightest, I was expressing how everyone in the past four pages of discussion and even some new faces posted they agreed with both suggestions.
Just like you give your opinion I was giving mine. ^^

I don’t feel that if new pets are added they’ll need some special coding from being new and in alphabetical order. If people don’t read the first post of additions why would they go through the entire list to see what was added?

As Animall said those who discuss here are community. They are voices and I still don’t see a need to poll every decision like this. Especially when nearly everyone posting has been for these two suggestions, something that’s a bit rare itself.
Because of so many people agreeing for it I feel it’s something we should do now.

i think the problem is more that some people read the list for the information the list itself offers, they don't necessarily check for updates/changes because they don't see it as applicable and so don't realise X or Y pet was recently added. when you're looking for information for a trade, you're probably going to skip the front page and try and skim-read for the info you need.

people who discuss on here are part of the community - not 'the' community. it's more about enabling more of the community to give their opinion on something without feeling the need to be met with confrontation on the thread which a lot of people are scared of due to anxiety and an unconfrontational attitude. i feel like implying that the thread itself is the only voice the community needs is a bit ignorant of people's qualms with the list and people's personal qualms which might prevent them from partaking. discussions and debate need to be made more accessible imo. it's worth mentioning that while there are a lot of new voices poking heads in, it's still definitely a small amount of users who want to participate in what ways they can.

[Animall]

I think we should wait a small amount of time to put the list in alphabetical order, as we just added a bunch of pets into the advent list and it may confuse people. I’d let those placements settle down and then put it in alphabetical order. In terms of moving the gap, this is an edit that should have been done a longggg time ago. It’s has always been misplaced and even says so on the front page. It has confused the entire community and they have voiced their opinions on this thread claiming that. It’s such a quick fix and doesn’t change the list at all, it just makes it more truthful at a glance instead of having to scroll all the way to the bottom. By ignoring this issue for so long I believe we have done more harm than good.

I also feel like people continuously saying “but this thread ISNT welcoming” does nothing but make it more unwelcoming. People did indeed come to this thread and discussed an issue and came to an agreement. We never originally ran polls if everyone agreed. It discredits the efforts of the community in the discussion if we were to poll something that we already agreed on.

[Shinryu]

i think the problem is more that some people read the list for the information the list itself offers, they don't necessarily check for updates/changes because they don't see it as applicable and so don't realise X or Y pet was recently added. when you're looking for information for a trade, you're probably going to skip the front page and try and skim-read for the info you need..

But if you're looking for information for a trade, what you'd do is to look up the pets in said trade to see their list positions, wouldn't you?
So even if it's someone who comes here to, say, look at the picture list because they don't know the names of all the pets, they'd still get the info they want - "is this on the list and where?"
There's only so much you can do for people who don't check out additional info. If they don't check for updates they may not realize that newly added pets are at the end of their tiers either.
It's always good to keep in mind that many people won't read up everything, that's true^^ But if they don't notice that a pet is/isn't on the list because they didn't bother checking properly, there's little that can be done for them.

You could always add something like a bracket saying (new) or whatever looks like a fancier solution, I guess?

[sinpai]

well there is no right or wrong in any of this and both sides are understandable but I do agree we should just ignore the "gap issue" for now since it's honestly not bothering that many people and we haven't even started the foal poll which should actually be almost done by now. The thread needs to quit going in a circle, nothing really new is being said. Let's do the foal poll before all else because we still have 2 more OMGSR to do if I remember right and right now all we are doing is wasting time chasing tail. Talk about the gap stuff while the foal poll is up or something. I've known what the "big gap" has meant for a long time just because I took the time to actually read and I don't find it to be as big of a deal as everyone is making it right now. It's not hurting anything and can be waited on until the foal poll is at least finished.

@Targaryen is right, the 20 people who post here frequently and the few new people aren't the community, in polls we see most of the community come to vote what they think which is hundreds compared to the 20 something people here. I may not be passionate about much in this game but in general I'm a real enthusiast for the general population getting to vote instead of a few to make some big changes. I'm sorry but I won't support no poll that is unfair to everyone else.


This thread isn't welcoming though, I was scared to post here for the longest time because dear Lord will you guys snap someone's head off in a minute. Plus I know a lot of people on this game have anxiety (along with myself) so they just may feel uncomfortable posting. I don't see why polling will hurt anything.

[Targaryen]

I think we should wait a small amount of time to put the list in alphabetical order, as we just added a bunch of pets into the advent list and it may confuse people. I’d let those placements settle down and then put it in alphabetical order. In terms of moving the gap, this is an edit that should have been done a longggg time ago. It’s has always been misplaced and even says so on the front page. It has confused the entire community and they have voiced their opinions on this thread claiming that. It’s such a quick fix and doesn’t change the list at all, it just makes it more truthful at a glance instead of having to scroll all the way to the bottom. By ignoring this issue for so long I believe we have done more harm than good.

I also feel like people continuously saying “but this thread ISNT welcoming” does nothing but make it more unwelcoming. People did indeed come to this thread and discussed an issue and came to an agreement. We never originally ran polls if everyone agreed. It discredits the efforts of the community in the discussion if we were to poll something that we already agreed on.

I also feel like people continuously saying “but this thread ISNT welcoming” does nothing but make it more unwelcoming.

i'm pro moving/deleting 'the gap' and shuffling/changing the tiers but it needs polled because of the reasons DD has iterated

deflecting blame and reason behind why the thread is stigmatised like this isn't helping anything or anybody. what made it unwelcome was the dog-piling - it's what everyone who feels this way has iterated throughout posts and private messages. it's not the people pointing out that this is the cause of more hostility. you can't fix the problem without acknowledging it first and it needs said so we can work on it. this conv's been said and done so i'm not sure why it's being brought up again.

like DD said, we moved past reaching consensus on the thread alone for a reason. it's a big decision and it should be polled to everyone because it effects everyone equally. i don't believe a poll is more of a discredit to the rares list discussion community more than a lack of a poll would be a discredit to the trading community as a whole.

the people who post on this thread aren't 'the entire community' voicing their concern. it's a small, small part of the community and you and i cannot speak on behalf of everyone who works based on the list. the phrase is a false pretence.

@zel
i mean you're working on the basis that people are looking for changes in the list even if they are going down to the names/pictures. people might not notice a change/addition to the list unless it's literally shoved in their face.
id be very pro a tag like 'new' in red but Id imagine that might make the coding just that bit more annoying.

edit
@obsidian
yeah, i agree for the most part - feels like the foal has been in discussion for too long now but I do think the 'gap' issue should be on the 'to-do' list. it needs addressed at some point and preferably sooner rather than later tbh.

[Animall]

This thread will move so ridiculously slow if we poll each and every thing that pops up. We need to decide what is important to poll and what isn’t so we can be productive rather than stagnant. Polling something that has already been agreed on through discussion just doesn’t seem important to me.

And there’s a difference between deflection and analyzation.

[DaDwarf]

Removing the gap will have a big impact on the trading community, so that's why i feel like it's not an as light decision as it seems to be. A lot of people focus on the gap, whether its a marker or not. People know that from the gap upwards, pets get worth more. With something that can potentially confuse a lot of people, why shouldn't we run the poll? It's not just removing a few words, look how many people advertise their pets as 'above the gap'.

I understand both view points. The gap is misplaced, it should be removed. we can easily just go by high mid low mains list pets. But i do think it's a bigger issue then its made out to be right now. Changing it without any warning or input from the bigger part of the community seems a step into the wrong direction.

people who discuss on here are part of the community - not 'the' community. it's more about enabling more of the community to give their opinion on something without feeling the need to be met with confrontation on the thread which a lot of people are scared of due to anxiety and an unconfrontational attitude. i feel like implying that the thread itself is the only voice the community needs is a bit ignorant of people's qualms with the list and people's personal qualms which might prevent them from partaking. discussions and debate need to be made more accessible imo. it's worth mentioning that while there are a lot of new voices poking heads in, it's still definitely a small amount of users who want to participate in what ways they can.

This is exactly what i'm saying. Saying we agreed on the thread doesn't mean the whole community agreed. And what i'm saying is simple, people agree on the thread while they might not agree, afraid of going against the herd. Because if you don't, you get many replies as to why you should just agree.

We originally never ran polls, and look what happened? A lot of people were angry and felt excluded. So that's why we are doing the polls. We shouldn't go back to saying 'if you want a voice then you have to post' because thats what the list was and thats what a lot of people didn't want anymore.

Slow VS Slow. We used to take months of discussing pets before moving or placing them, now we take.. what? a week or 2 to discuss the poll and gather trades and then a week or 2 to run the poll? Make it short, discuss for a week, run the poll for 10 days, welp. We aren't going slow, we are going fast and there's literally no reason to rush things anymore. We've got all the time in the world to update this thread, what exactly is the rush?

Community input = polls. simple as that.

You could always add something like a bracket saying[/color] (new) or whatever looks like a fancier solution, I guess?[/list]

adding because i do love this idea lol